None whatsoever. In fact, a steady sustained and sustainable weight loss is an excellent way to reverse what’s been a steady sustained weight gain, I imagine…even though weight loss doesn’t seem to happen in such a neat linear fashion as your math suggests.
My correction…as I pointed out a second time…was to your blanket statement that a weight loss of 25 lb a year was some sort of maximum where loss of muscle/lean mass/non-fat weight began inevitably.That is not the case …especially in someone “morbidly obese” (which, for context…easy to lose with random responses…was a weight loss necessary for someone hoping to be medically eligible for knee replacement surgery)
Example for clarity…I am 5’6". Currently toggling around 135/136lbs. This is 3 or 4 pounds heavier than my customary weight. Those extras are not muscle. As I’ve mentioned, my current exercise regimen is heavily focused in muscle/strength re-gains, so I’ve increased my daily rations…primarily protein…so as not to stymie this goal. To qualify as “morbidly obese”/Class 3 obesity, I would need to be around 300lbs (double checked on Goggle’s AI overview) If I needed to drop significant poundage from this number, a 25lb loss would be scratching the surface and those new knees…and meaningful improvements in other obesity related pathologies…would remain elusive.
Significant excess body fat…and I’m talking waaaay before a designation of clinical obesity…has so many adverse consequences, a more speedy fat loss approach is most likely a far better bet in terms of overall health than your implication of an annual max of 25 lbs a year.
What we agree on strength training and upping the protein intake. It is hard to hold onto muscle while losing weight. Losing more weight quickly leads to greater muscle loss. That is problematic for many people.
No I have not. Probably wouldn’t with the protein shakes. FOMO would need to be much stronger for me to try. Over the years, I’ve experimented with a lot and found they all taste pretty much like you’d expect from the list of ingredients.
Since checking on the brand, I’ve been heavily marketed to and finally succumbed to/bamboozled by claims to deliciousness (and why would they lie???) with this product that was just delivered…
So a definite thumbs up. Plausible taste…close to what I’d expect a watermelon flavored pedialyte to taste like. I wouldn’t make it a big part of my diet but it’s a nice surprise to find something to add to a day’s protein allowance.
This vegan mix with a complete protein. The big difference here is adding fresh milk. Recommended getting roasted peanut butter powder to add a heaping teaspoon.
A plant based protein supplement wouldn’t serve my particular needs. Since I’m looking for a high quality protein source with best bang for the calorie count, whey isolate beats plant based hands down.
As I’ve mentioned, my goals are rebuilding lost muscle mass as a bit of a priority…but not at the expense of too much by way of additional fat gain. The extra protein intake I’m aiming for doesn’t allow for too many unnecessary calories to go along with it. Especially since most of my protein intake comes from actual food …where theres the inevitable addition of fat and carbs…and not supplemental shakes and whatnot.
Two sets of RDLs…100lbs for 8 reps now. Getting there.
I’ve tried all the powders, and the older versions all tasted chalky to me. The never versions are MUCH better, Orgain is quite good, Nurri is terrific, etc. However, in the end they are “expensive” sources of protein, both monetarily and nutritionally, mainly because they inevitably get ADDED to the diet rather than replacing a less beneficial food. The old mainstays for protein are still the best choices - eggs (whites if you are afraid of good fats), chicken breast (at least 100 easy and tasty ways to prepare them), most light colored fish (or seafood in some cases), and even plain old canned tuna (the easiest and quickest way to ingest some protein). These all give you about 20g of protein in about 100 calories, a great “deal” nutritionally.
If you’re asking about macronutrient profile, the numbers for each would be readily available on the usual online sources.
If you’re asking whether they’re as satisfying and worthwhile as a breakfast dish, I’d have to go to the trouble of trying them out, with the various things cooked and the other ingredients …and I can’t be arsed.
I enjoy a cooked breakfast…but only if someone else cooks it for me. My Tuesday Rotary breakfast (pretty close to a “Full English”) is one such treat. Likewise Thursday am post early workout breakfast burrito shared with my daughter in the gym Cafe. We both got there super early today and had given our muscles a good spanking well before the cafe opened at 7 so it’s home and cottage cheese, an assortment of berries and nuts and preceded by a protein drink that is quite tolerable that I’ve only just discovered and I used to take advantage of that post workout window of extra insulin sensitivity and to keep the muscle building stimulus strong.
I highlighted the beans because I actually don’t count beans and other plant based protein sources (like today’s almonds etc) among my daily protein allowance. One reason being I want to make sure I don’t overestimate my consumption so, even if I’ve got me sums wrong, the plant based sources might fill the gap. Mainly though is that they are incomplete proteins…and even committed vegans with any gumption acknowledge this. Sure, you can do appropriate mixing etc but, not surprisingly, I really can’t be arsed to do this.
Now this is where you have to have a clue or 6.5 about nutritional biochemistry and physiology…and they’re important sciences that apply to all of us and have important impacts in the Chronologically Enriched population. The math on paper might show comparable macronutrient profiles…but things change dramatically after these various sources get eaten and it all adds up to bioavailability and impact on aging muscle and the attendant anabolic resistance that increases with age.
Sorry about the long answer…didn’t have time for a short one. And you can be sure I’m not going to pretend with an AI overview selection of twaddle.
Here’s today’s drink. It’s a sort of whey supplemented kefir…
The particular Orgain mix I use has 8 g fiber, 0.5 g of sat fat, and 21 g of protein per two scoops. Since it is vegetables it is high in vitamins.
The cost is about $3.70 for three scoops. I bought 20 jars to last 160 days at Costco during a $7 off sale. So $27 per jar which lasts 8 days at three scoops.
I add blueberries and a banana, along with over a cup of 1% milk. The milk makes it.
A proper protein, ie a small steak, chop etc…costs $7 or more. As we age we need that.
If you look up your protein needs online, they are quite high. It might be an eye opener to see for yourselves.
So, @iampops5 , just for spits and giggles…and I don’t like to drop sciencey sounding words like anabolic resistance etc (else it’ll look as if I might’ve lied about the AI overview)…I typed “plant based protein and anabolic resistance” into Google’s search box to see if there were any serious looks at the phenom. I didn’t know for sure when I made the comment…it just seemed mechanistically plausible and, with the human body, you can’t really be sure unless you look.
Well, of course, if I’ve had the idea you can be pretty darn sure plenty of others have been there before me. First article up…
Dumping it here for ease of reference for me. This looks set to be a fair bit of interesting reading to get to grips with and this morning isn’t a derriere in the computer chair for moi…and, such time as I have available is set to be spent on tracking down incidents of identity theft in the family.
I knew the answer to my question was way too complicated for a message board setting. Thank you for offering a potentially decent article on point that I plan to read in a day or two when time warrants.
I personally try to supplement my mostly vegetable protein diet with either sardines on Matzo with sauerkraut for breakfast, or eggs and beans with toast or oats for breakfast because I am still committed to eating real food. But some of my smartest friends, including medical professionals and family, are now eating protein powders.
I just glanced at your posted study. It mentions soy. I wanted to confirm a mix of pea, rice, and chia seeds was a complete protein. There is a difference, no soy.
Yes, a mix of peas, rice, and chia seeds provides all nine essential amino acids, making it an effective complete protein source. [1, 2, 3]
Why the Combination Works
Peas (Legumes): High in the essential amino acid lysine, but lower in methionine.
Rice (Grains): High in methionine and cysteine, but low in lysine.
Chia Seeds: Add a wide range of amino acids, minerals, fiber, and healthy omega-3 fatty acids to round out the nutritional profile. [1, 2, 4]
Nutritional Benefits
Complementary Profile: Combining a legume (peas) with a grain (rice) naturally balances out individual amino acid shortages.
Daily Intake: You do not even need to eat them in the exact same bite; getting a diverse mix of plant proteins throughout the same day is enough for your body to build complete proteins. [1, 5, 6]
If you’d like, let me know:
Are you using these ingredients in a protein powder blend or as whole foods?
What is your main fitness or dietary goal?
I can give you more tailored advice on portion sizes or recipes.
Well, Oct 9 is my first shot of Mounjaro. My trying on my own is backfiring in several ways. But the mistakes have been educational. The chaos around trying to diet on my own is not worth it. I am too busy to fight this on a few fronts all day long for months on end. This is not me sitting alone during a pandemic. My health comes first.
My mostly plant based diet was already heavy in complementary proteins, mixing grains like rice, beans and oats with legumes like beans, lentils and chickpeas, but I was still getting really thin. Regular dumbbells give me some definition, but my good cholesterol and lipid readings are offset by my concern for muscle mass and bone density.
That’s a brief history behind my decision to supplement my primarily plant based diet with oats and a dab of peanut butter before I lift on dumbbell days, and sardines and matzos afterwards. And eggs and beans and oats on the other days. Plus plant based diet the rest of the day. And still 6’2” and struggling to keep my weight above 160#.
@Leap1 …if your success is a mere 50% of my daughter’s, you’ll be beyond thrilled!!! Srsly.
I’m pretty sure that her story isn’t isolated but success doesn’t seem to grab the headlines much. My regret is that she/we didn’t treat her as a case study with a few biomarkers measured before and after. The Usual Suspects for bloodwork, maybe an advanced DEXA scan (body composition as well as bone density) etc. As it was, there’s a scale at the gym that does a rough estimate of body composition via bio impedance that she used to track important stuff like visceral fat. If there’s one available do a “before”
It’s “common knowledge” that it can take as much as a month to feel the effects, apparently, and she was prepared for that. What she wasn’t prepared for was the food noise quieting down so speedily. I got a very early morning phone call 2 or 3 days after her first shot…“Mummy…I feel like my old self!” Her natural self discipline emerged and she never had to increase from the intro dose (.25mg, I think)
In all, she lost about 28lbs and most of it fat…especially visceral. Coincidentally, just about the weight of the male Snowy Albatross. Fitting, right? Apart from the umbilical hernia episode, no side effects to complain about.
I have had such success before the drugs. But out of 50 pounds 20 are back and now I have 50 more to lose in total or net. I should be 170.
The food noise is a problem. I pride myself on quitting cigs, alcohol etc…but I have to eat. And eat…it seems. Still can have half tackled the noise, I can not keep it up for weeks on end. I am far too busy.
BIl told me 50% who start on the drugs stop in the first year. All sorts of reasons. 15% it does nothing for. Most people gain back the weight if they stop, but he did not know about recent studies weening people off the drugs is more successful.
You could say the same for most any weight loss strategy. I’m sure there are stats for weight regain after bariatric surgery as folk learn to override the physical restriction in order to eat more. Likewise BP meds (yes folk really do discontinue them for whatever reason occurs to them) Even anti rejection meds following organ transplantation. Folk have funny ideas.
Cost aside, if a long term maintenance dose is all you need after you’ve reached a reasonable weight, just look at it the way sensible folk who have, say, primary hypertension do and view it as long term maintenance for further disease prevention.
Edit: FWIW, I happily “popped a pill” daily … THE Pill … for 25+ years (except for a few strategic months) Helped me avoid a whole passel of problems
