“Doctor is pretty safe. People will always need them, and they are very unlikely to be replaced by computers/machines. Nurses: same.”
A lot of doctors I talk to these days HATE their profession - or the way the field
is managed and regulated.
Howie52
Professionals generally dislike being told how to do their jobs by bureaucrats or less
trained regulators.
Especially when those groups of folks have an actual point.
The GPs who treat most patients continue to get squeezed by Medicare. Specialists usually do ok. But yes, insurance payments drive lots of decisions. That must be frustrating.
Most doctors have at least one person on staff to negotiate with the insurance companies.
“The GPs who treat most patients continue to get squeezed by Medicare. Specialists usually do ok. But yes, insurance payments drive lots of decisions. That must be frustrating.”
Thhe problems I hear are more related to hospital management groups - not so much
insurance or Medicare regulation. I suspect docs and nurses grew accustomed to those
sources of frustration and figured out how to get around the most idiotic problems.
But overbearing management can kill anyone’s joy in their work.
1poorguy writes,
I trained as a physicist. I would not recommend it unless someone wanted to go into academia. I was lucky, in retrospect. I thought I was so clever studying the “mother science”. “I can be trained to do anything.” Yeah…they already wanted me to be trained in an engineering discipline. Gamma ray astrophysics just confused them. I got the one manager who said “I can teach this guy what he needs, and he’ll run with it”. Like I said: lucky.
The most successful hedge fund in history is Renaissance Technologies, started in 1982 by former MIT math professor James Simons. If you invested $10,000 in its flagship Medallion Fund in 1982, you’d have over $40 million today. (It’s closed to new investors.)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Renaissance_Technologies
Renaissance Technologies famously avoids hiring MBAs and people with a finance background. They prefer to hire computer scientists, mathematicians, physicists, signal processing experts and statisticians.
As James Simons says, "I can teach a physics major finance, but I can’t teach a finance major physics.
intercst
Semiconductor processing is replete with chemical engineers. And chips aren’t going away anytime soon.
A minor in materials science would help a lot.
data, data and data.
After starting out as a general networking and IT specialist, I moved to a more focused business intelligence role using a specific reporting tool. While that tool remains supported (at least through 2025 and probably longer), the business intelligence field has indeed advanced more into data analytics and new cloud-based AI-driven solutions.
Unfortunately, I have not advanced along with the profession. Part intentional decision, part circumstance (when you work as a contractor, you are not hired to learn new tools), I have chosen to ride my current specialty as far as I can, and that’s been a 20 year career so far since leaving Turner Broadcasting back in 2003, victim to the worst merger in the history of mergers.
Fuskie
Who keeps an eye on job opportunities out there while working his current 30 month (and counting) contract, and he needs to drive down this highway for another 4 years before he starts having retirement options that will let him be more discriminating as to when, or if, he wants to work…
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You’ve got to LIKE your chosen career. Not select a career based upon monetary returns.
I’ve seen many ‘bored’ engineers who wind up in a rut, don’t like the rut, but don’t have the drive to learn/do something different to get out of the rut. Others seem to like the rut until they become obsolete at one point or another, or just happen to be in the right rut for career survival.
I liked radio technology and got a broad based engineering degree in Electrical Engineering, Worked for first company 3 years in communications technology - two way radio systemms. They had a tendency to hire scads of new engineers, design a new product line, then lay most of them off after the product line was in production. Years later they’d repeat the process for the next new product line.
Much more careful in selecting next new company to work for and there for 13 years till Neutron Jack axed most of our profitable division. Went from design engineer to systems engineer working on large city/state projects.
then had opportunity to get into cellular radio in early phase designing cellular systems. Fun work - lasted a few years till company sold off business and I bounced into Advanced Technology group. Everything from digital microwave systems - later to fiber optic amps and satellite broadcast technology to undersea fiber cable systems.
I was a voracious reader. Collected books on communications technology and history.
You had to be curious. You had to keep up with latest technology in industry.
Got my MSEE degree at University nearby and company paid 100% tuition. I had to pay for books.
Got degree and took another 10 courses working on MA Telecom Policy
Got transferred to TX and continued - worked 17 years for company and early retired at 52.
Some anecdotes. In my library of about 500 books, I had come across an 1890s tome from the British Telecom authority. 3 volumes - 1000 pages. Everything on how to design, install, test, repair from the details of cable laying ship mechanisms to recovery and repair of cables from 3000 feet deep. All the problems, special requirements for cable armoring, etc. Also had the 1950s AT&T comprehensive book on TAT cables across the oceans. One day boss asks around if anyone knows anything about undersea cable systems. Bingo. Next thing I’m on my plane with my boss to London England for a week to discuss and review design specs for new undersea fiber cable - TAT X. Other than fiber instead of copper cable, 90% of the technology of getting the cable into the ocean exactly the same. Same cable laying mechanisms. Same repair systems. Updated of course with more modern equipment. Fun. Later company decided not to do the cable system because AT&T suddenly moved up 2 other ‘future’ systems by years (immediate future) to avoid new competition. Which was part of the plan. If they didn’t the new system would go ahead.
Of course, two way radio systems were separate from ‘cellular’ but naturally I read all the IEEE journals on evolving technology. When the opportunity to get into the cellular business came about, I was ready (most weren’t in my department).
Company was looking at getting into satellite broadcasting. Naturally in bounced into the Advanced Technology group for the technical part. Wasn’t up to speed but luckily there was a 4 day intensive course in satellite broadcast technology at a local facility (taught by a 3rd party who had designed satellites for the industry). Fantastic 4 day intensive workshop everything from radio transponder design to thermal stability, electrostatic shielding, G-testing, solar cells, power systems, fuel systems for orbit maintenance., etc. . talked boss into it. Great. Next thing I know we are off to the satellite construction company to review specs. One fellow in department wound up going the Ukraine to arrange satellite launch on Russian rockets. Company later decided the finances didn’t quite line up with high return as some other projects would, but it was fun couple of months work.
There again, if you kept up on technology, curious about lots of things, know where to get the resources quickly to be up to speed… a ‘jack of many trades’. Not in a rut.
Today I wouldn’t recommend ‘electrical engineering’ to most. Unless you find a good niche. too many cycles of ups and downs.
Go into computer engineering - or if you want to be an EE - power engineering for longevity. Got to be PE for most of those jobs in the power industry .
Or semi-conductor engineering/technology - but most of that probably takes a MS or PhD.
Nephew went same college as me- but in comp science. Doing very well - changed jobs once or twice in 25 years. Making lotsa bucks. Knows his stuff. Then again, he keeps up on things. You’ve got to.
my 2c worth
t.
The best solution is develop a retire early plan. That gives many options to consult, start your own business, teach, etc.
Paul, great advice. I’d like to add that if consulting or starting your own business is possibly in your future, it would be best to make sure that you have all of the skills and support needed to be successful in your new endeavor.
I’d suggest that anyone considering these career options, please talk with a SCORE.org mentor prior to starting so that you have a better idea of what you may be getting into. They have the tools and experience to help you set up a realistic business plan for getting started in your own business.
I have been a SCORE business counselor for the past 6 years or so and I have had the opportunity to help a number of people who have been displaced from their position, decided to strike it out on their own, and come to the stark realization that they DO NOT have ALL of the skills needed to succeed in building a consulting or small business. Successful small business owners typically are more well-rounded and have the foundational skills needed such as: money and time management, inventory management, sales and marketing combined with a strong desire to win in the marketplace. These are not skills that most “career folks” have the opportunity to develop throughout their career working for a typical company.
SCORE has 100,000 mentors across the country that can be available for guidance and consultation on a host of topics re: small business startup, growth and divestiture. They receive a minimal amount of Federal funding through a grant from the Small Business Administration - so it’s your Federal tax dollars at work. The services are free and confidential.
Here’s a link their website → www.score.org
'38Packard
I know a pharmacist who also has an MBA. He -apparently rightly- thought it would give him a better resume (i.e. more marketable). He has just been made manager of a hospital pharmacy.
"As James Simons says, “I can teach a physics major finance, but I can’t teach a finance major physics.”
Would take a teacher to teach anyone.
Howie52
I know a pharmacist who also has an MBA. He -apparently rightly- thought it would give him a better resume (i.e. more marketable). He has just been made manager of a hospital pharmacy.
Someone filling pill bottles at Walgreens already makes a fortune. I noticed yesterday that Walgreens is offering $75,000 signing bonuses for pharmacists. (Apparently too many of their stores have had to restrict pharmacy hours due to the lack of credentialed and licensed staff.)
You’d really need to evaluate whether the bump in pay for “Manager of hospital pharmacy” is worth the additional grief.
I declined more than one promotion during my career because the pay bump wasn’t worth the additional BS. (Of course, by that time I’d figured out that the road to wealth was through the low tax rates you could realize through personal investment portfolio management, rather than additional wage & salary income.)
intercst
“Doctor is pretty safe. People will always need them, and they are very unlikely to be replaced by computers/machines. Nurses: same.”
******************************************************************************
A lot of doctors I talk to these days HATE their profession - or the way the field
is managed and regulated.
Having retired after 25 years in the business (and some would say too young), being a doctor is NOT safe. Why? You have all these “physician extenders/pretenders” wanting more and more privileges to do what we do. They say they can do things cheaper (salary) and just as safely (flawed studies) and unfortunately politicians listen. The biggest outrage/funny story in my former state, pols wanted to severely restrict a physicians ability to prescribe narcotics. Document, document, document and you still might get a nasty visit/raid on your office. But on the other hand, PAs (physician assistants) and NPs (nurse practitioners) want that prescription ability, no problem. ??? I’m sorry, want to play doctor, go to medical school. Not that I’m bashing them, I know several that are really good and conscientious and I know several MDs that I wouldn’t let get within 100 miles of me.
Then you have insurance companies and government determining what “cookbook” fashion you have to treat your patients. One sad story was a woman that had a hip replacement denied for well over a year because she was only 45 and not 65. Forget the fact that she had multiple surgeries over the years from the auto accident that caused multiple compound fractures and her hip damage.
The last straw for me, and a condition I would not work under, companies buying up practices. Essentially you become an hourly wage earner. Have little to no input on how things run. But many new grads are looking at that because a bird in the hand to pay off debt verses making your own way and coming out ahead several years down the road.
I could give you plenty examples of physicians being their own worst enemies but that would be too long.
Ok, ranting off. I loved my profession while it was just me taking care of a patient. Unfortunately that was most frequently while on medical mission trips. I hated the bean counter and pencil pushers that got in the way.
JLC
He works in a hospital pharmacy. He says Walgreen, CVS, or equivalent are more difficult. He likes the hospital. And apparently the pay bump was significant. But he has to wear a tie now, which he doesn’t like.
1poorguy writes,
He works in a hospital pharmacy. He says Walgreen, CVS, or equivalent are more difficult. He likes the hospital. And apparently the pay bump was significant. But he has to wear a tie now, which he doesn’t like.
Also hospital pharmacies tend to be 24/7 operations, so if he’s the boss, he’s likely working 9 to 5.
intercst
Renaissance Technologies famously avoids hiring MBAs and people with a finance background. They prefer to hire computer scientists, mathematicians, physicists, signal processing experts and statisticians.
As James Simons says, "I can teach a physics major finance, but I can’t teach a finance major physics.
Yeah, one of my old housemates from my Caltech days stopped being a Ph.D. astrophysicist and went to Renaissance in the '90s. I’m sure he went on to untold wealth.
-IGU-
Would you recommend your profession to the young?
I was a computer programmer for most of my career. I would absolutely recommend it, but…
I don’t think it’s something for most people. If you don’t have a knack for thinking the right way, you’ll never be any good at it. If you’re no good at something, I don’t think you should do it.
Nowadays, programming is a good way to earn a lot of money fast and easy from anywhere. But only if you’re good at it. And it’s not as though you won’t have to work hard and put in long hours, but it will mostly be fun.
-IGU-
I used to code FORTRAN. Was pretty decent at it. I never got the hang of C. Just didn’t make sense to me.
When I became a failure analysis engineer, I learned 8-bit microcontroller assembly, and it made sense again. We have a C compiler, but I never used it. C didn’t make sense. Assembly did.
1poorguy
If you don’t have a knack for thinking the right way, you’ll never be any good as a [computer programmer].
Totally agree. I always said that to be a good programmer you have to be weird in a particular way.
programming is a good way to earn a lot of money fast and easy from anywhere. But only if you’re good at it. And it’s not as though you won’t have to work hard and put in long hours, but it will mostly be fun.
We used to have a joke. After looking at our private workstations, private printer, computer lab, etc. we’d say “All this…and they pay us, too!!!”
I used to code FORTRAN. Was pretty decent at it. I never got the hang of C. Just didn’t make sense to me.
FORTRAN and COBOL were okay for applications but you needed to be good with machine and assembly languages for the really fun stuff. I had access to the complete source for BSD Unix but never developed real proficiency in the C language beyond modifying Unix to support additional devices.
I may have spent too many years writing machine language code for mass storage subsystems and communications devices and assembly language interrupt service routines, device drivers/handlers to have the proper mindset for the C language.
For most of my career, I was the tool-smith mentioned in The Mythical Man-Month*. The problem with the role is that you have to work a lot harder to ensure that the software satisfies the specification and produces consistent, predictable, and reproducible results.*
When I became a failure analysis engineer, I learned 8-bit microcontroller assembly, and it made sense again. We have a C compiler, but I never used it. C didn’t make sense. Assembly did.
It’s all going to be quantum computing in the future, and only a select and fortunate few will understand anything.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quantum_computing
intercst