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#4

I think you are misreading the tea leaves. But if you want to make a move that’s Mad as a Hatter, go ahead.

Disney didn’t want to go political, but its workforce pulled it in that direction. With a large number of cast members employed in Florida, the laws being passed in the state have a significant impact on those people and their families. While the state GOP believes it is lifting up families, that perspective is not universal. There are a large number who believe the laws instead undermine families.

And it is clear that we are in an era where societal pressures are increasingly forcing companies to represent the feelings and attitudes of their employees as well as their customers. After initially walking the fine line of avoidance, both groups forced the company to take a stand.

Personally, I see no negative for Disney here. Kids love Disney IP regardless of the political perspectives of their parents. So they are still going to want to see Disney World or Disneyland, they are still going to watch Disney+, Disney Channel and Disney XD. They are still going to go see movies in the theater. And they are still going to want Disney merchandise.

So from an investment perspective, I don’t think this is going to impact Disney at all, just as I don’t expect Disney’s position is going to stop the state’s lawmakers from continuing down the path they set before them.

Fuskie
Who notes it is going to get a lot of media attention because it’s Disney and it’s Florida, but from an investment perspective, his conviction in the company’s long-term (3-5 years or longer) business growth potential remains strong…

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#5

I’m pretty sure their IP will continue to generate profits, dividends, stock price appreciation over the long term. But that’s not why I want to sell the stock- it is their hypocrisy. Invest in the future you want to see, someone said. That’s why I sold my facebook too.

#6

if hypocrisy and not the politics is the value you use to eliminate stocks you have a very limited investment choice IMO. - Ned

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#7

OhHomer,

Disney has recently gone political and woke to undermine families. Has anyone noticed this trend?

Yes, there was some very recent discussion of this on a radio program called “Nightside” (host Dan Rae), which airs on WBZ AM (103 KHz) in Boston – but this station’s signal carries to 38 states and most of the eastern half of Canada, and it also steams on the Internet as well. The discussion also extended to the company’s higher prices that many “working class” families probably can’t afford.

Thinking of selling my shares in this company.

I’m having similar thoughts. Unfortunately, this “wokeness” permeates the entertainment industry so the question is with what to replace it.

Norm.

1 Like
#8

The complaints about gate prices squeezing out the working class have been going on for years. The argument in favor is that there is a lot of value packed into that ticket price, but it’s no small constellation for those who cannot afford it.

For many families, a Disney vacation is a once-in-a-lifetime experience, and for that experience, Disney works hard to make it worth while. But at the end of the day, they need to make enough money to cover park operations.

As has been discussed previously, gate prices basically cover the cost of operations and payroll. Resort profits come primarily through food and merchandise sales. If Disney wanted to operate the resorts at a loss, they could lower gate prices and be more accessible to middle and lower income families, but that would also lead to higher park occupancy and lower guest satisfaction, which would mean slower food and merchandise sales.

So what do you want to do? Make the park more accessible but reduce your net profit? Or continue to leverage pricing power to control attendance and improve the guest experience?

Fuskie
Who doesn’t care how many states a radio program reaches if the majority of people in those states don’t listen to radio… :slight_smile:

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#9

Thanks. There was a leaked zoom call among senior company leadership outlining their agenda which was disturbing. They are becoming activists. there was a double standard in the way they treated Gina Carano and Whoopie Goldberg. Their recent movies like Luca and Turning Red have been bad. Their employees have felt abandoned by the company’s actions during the pandemic. Prices are soaring. This will be a real test of Bob Paycheck’s leadership. As David and Tom Gardner says, (paraphrase) invest in the future you want to see.

#10

Fuskie,

Disney didn’t want to go political, but its workforce pulled it in that direction.

Only because the company’s executives lack the backbone to tell the employees that the company is not a political entity, and will not involve itself in political decisions.

Sure, some “woke” employees won’t like it, and might even quit. But they are a very vocal, but very small, minority.

With a large number of cast members employed in Florida, the laws being passed in the state have a significant impact on those people and their families. While the state GOP believes it is lifting up families, that perspective is not universal. There are a large number who believe the laws instead undermine families.

There is a lot of misconception based on distorted reporting. The reality is that the law, dubbed “don’t say gay” by the woke left, actually does not even contain that word, and it also pertains only to curricula for kindergarten through third grade, whereas the distorted reporting has created a misconception that it extends even into high school.

Personally, I see no negative for Disney here.

There’s a huge risk. Parents who come to the belief that new Disney productions have content that is not suitable for their children will act in accord with that belief – with the consequence that their families won’t be going to Disney parks or on Disney cruises and they won’t be watching Disney movies and television productions. If that’s a majority of the population, it could cut the company’s revenues in half.

The risk on the other side of this issue is a LOT less. So-called “LGBTQ” (or whatever the latest alphabet soup is) adults tend not to have children.

Norm.

#11

I don’t know what you’re smoking but Luca was up for an Oscar. I still haven’t had a chance to see Turning Red, and Carano and Goldberg stepped into their own pile of shitake. As for the pandemic, no revenue means no payroll. Disney carried the cast members as long as they could and pushed to reopen as fast as it could. I’m not sure how you would have done things differently if you had been CEO.

Fuskie
Who notes at some point, as much as an investor might be a fan of Disney product and content, they have to decide whether they also want to be an investor of the business and recognize that it is not easy to make business decisions that satisfy all fans…

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#12

Amen from a long time Disney investor and fan. - Ned

#13

Norm, I’m not going to get into the law. People are going to see in it what they want to see in it.

Disney is still trying to ramp up its staffing for the theme parks, and driving cast members away is not a good strategy.

Disney has stood for family friendly entertainment for decades and that standard has not changed because it has chosen to side with its cast members. I do not see a mass boycott of Disney’s theme parks as a result of choosing its cast members. But having the reputation as an unfavorable employer could have a drastic impact.

Fuskie
Who thinks it is a mistake to assume that LGBTQ families do not include children…

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#14

What you run into is the economic theory called a Laffer Curve. Originally used to describe how increasing taxes rates affect tax revenues. The Curve shows how you can actually decrease your revenue collection by increasing your taxes too high.

The Laffer Curve has been used in other situations to describe how raising prices can decrease profits by reaching a point of decreasing revenues. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laffer_curve

So the question is; At price does the Disney pricing start to decrease revenue?

OTFoolish

#15

Fuskie,

Disney is still trying to ramp up its staffing for the theme parks, and driving cast members away is not a good strategy.

True, but alienating customers is even worse. A response to the effect that it’s not appropriate for the company to involve itself in politics would not have driven away enough to cast members, or prospective cast members, to matter. A handful of activists might quit, but the overwhelming majority would not. By contrast, the apparent plan to introduce overtly homosexual characters into new movies and other content targeted at young children is apt to alienate a lot of families who think that young children are not ready for exposure to issues of human sexuality.

Disney has stood for family friendly entertainment for decades and that standard has not changed because it has chosen to side with its cast members. I do not see a mass boycott of Disney’s theme parks as a result of choosing its cast members. But having the reputation as an unfavorable employer could have a drastic impact.

This is where actions speak louder than words. Introduction of overtly homosexual characters into the company’s movies and other content, including the company’s theme parks, raises issues of human sexuality to which many parents don’t want to expose their young children, and thus does not qualify as “family friendly” under any reasonable definition of that expression.

Norm.

#16

I don’t smoke anything (I know it was a joke), but Luca is a not a good movie. Oscar confirmation does not legitimize anything for me. The misconception that Disney is supporting its cast members on this issue is false…this move is actually not supportive of the majority of its cast members, but catering to a small vocal minority. There have been Disney staff who state that the company does not speak for them on this issue.

#17

Norm, again, I am not going to debate your “any reasonable definition” claim. In my experience, the more black and white an issue, the more grey area there is.

Bottom line is I do not believe a significant amount of Disney’s customer base will be alienated. I think there is a lot of unwanted media attention that will eventually pass. Disney is a big, public and popular company that attracts attention and attention-seekers. It will always be the target of those who want to leverage it for their self-promotional purposes. Those who shout the loudest tend to be heard but that does not make their message any more valid than those who are shouted out.

Fuskie
Who recently saw a CNN+ interview with former Fox newsman Chris Wallace and former CEO Bob Iger, and interestingly, he seemed to agree with Disney’s position, saying that Disney tries to stay neutral in the culture wars, though it has long stood for inclusivity in its workforce as well as its content, but will and has a history of standing up for causes that can have a significant impact to cast members, to guests or to shareholders, from offering free GED and community college education to cast members, to acknowledging its contributions to and combatting climate change, so to say that Disney does not have an obligation to its cast members or has never been drawn into politics would be to view the company’s history through convenient blinders…

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#18

But how is supporting gender identity education for 5-8 year olds supportive of the majority of cast members or the families it entertains?

#19

I’m not going to engage in a debate over the merits of the law. Any such posts not related to Disney will be removed.

Fuskie
Who notes there is a active Political Asylum board for Fools who want to debate such things…

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#20

Fuakie,

OhHomer: But how is supporting gender identity education for 5-8 year olds supportive of the majority of cast members or the families it entertains?

You: I’m not going to engage in a debate over the merits of the law. Any such posts not related to Disney will be removed.

I don’t see how OhHomer’s question has anything to do with the “merits of the law.” He asked how supporting what the law forbids is supportive of the majority of cast members and customers. That question directly pertains to Disney.

Incidentally, I saw an article on a news feed yesterday morning which said that a LOT of Disney cast members are objecting to Disney’s action on social media sites. Unfortunately, the article had disappeared from the news feed later in the day when I had time to post it. :frowning: I think it’s fair to say, however, that Disney’s employees are not exactly united behind Disney’s decision in this matter.

Norm.

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#21

I think it’s fair to say, however, that Disney’s employees are not exactly united behind Disney’s decision in this matter.

Disney has 80,000 employees in Florida. I think it’s fair to say that there is likely to be disagreement about issues in any group of 80,000 people.

This is where actions speak louder than words. Introduction of overtly homosexual characters into the company’s movies and other content, including the company’s theme parks, raises issues of human sexuality to which many parents don’t want to expose their young children, and thus does not qualify as “family friendly” under any reasonable definition of that expression.

Disney spent 100 years not having a single gay character in its movies, tv shows, animated features or theme parks, even though there have been gay people in every culture on every continent in human history. I don’t think having one or two here or there is going to be the end of the world - or the corporation. As a shareholder I do want them to I do what’s best, and “inclusion”, including adding minorities, foreign influences, and other things that were ignored for so long seems to have benefited them (and me!).

Of course I’m in favor of not going to films if you don’t want to go to them; I have the same policy with grocery stores and car dealerships so…

1 Like
#22

Goofyhoofy,

Disney has 80,000 employees in Florida. I think it’s fair to say that there is likely to be disagreement about issues in any group of 80,000 people.

For sure!

Disney spent 100 years not having a single gay character in its movies, tv shows, animated features or theme parks, even though there have been gay people in every culture on every continent in human history. I don’t think having one or two here or there is going to be the end of the world - or the corporation. As a shareholder I do want them to I do what’s best, and “inclusion”, including adding minorities, foreign influences, and other things that were ignored for so long seems to have benefited them (and me!).

In principle, I don’t disagree with your comment as it pertains to content intended for adults. I would not take issue with a character who happens to be homosexual in a movie, or whatever, that’s intended for an adult audience – and it’s certainly true of some of the company’s movie production business.

But when it comes to content intended for children, the content needs to be appropriate to the age of the intended audience. I generally would say that content pertaining to human sexuality is not appropriate at all in content intended for children under the age of ten, and it’s not exactly a cliff that makes it an open season in content intended for younger teenagers.

Norm.

1 Like
#23

Not only is this NOT the proper forum for this conversation, it also is not a good idea for Disney to be publicly involved in a no-win situation.

To close this argument there has been NO evidence of ANY Disney LGBTQ+ character targeting 5- to 8-year-old children and in FACT there has been NO proof of education programs targeting sex education in this age group.

This is just another Dog Whistle for a certain political group and nothing else.

OTFoolish

P.S. Disney and Hollywood have had LGBTQ+ actors and actresses in TV and film for decades.