Ford Responses to Tesla

Except that Tesla has been building Gigafactory’s and new assembly line’s in different Countries all along while getting those margins. They are just more efficient.

Andy

3 Likes

Is there a secret sauce or can F and GM copy the tomato sauce pretty much to spec?

Tesla was incorporated in July 2003 by Tesla. In February 2004. Tesla began production of its first car model, the[Roadster sports car, in 2009. This was followed by the [Model S] sedan in 2012, the [Model X SUV in 2015, the [Model 3] sedan in 2017, the [Model Y crossover in 2020, and the [Tesla Semi] truck in 2022.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesla,_Inc.

2021 was its first profitable year.

Admittedly Tesla had huge hurdles to overcome, but as they say, the pioneer is the first one to get the arrows shot at him, too.

And I will not be surprised to see some of the current companies go toes up or be diminished in size. When I grew up you could buy a Packard, a Studebaker, a Nash Rambler, and a host of other nameplates that are no longer around. Heck, I’ve watched Saturn come and go, Hummer come and go and come back again, and I even almost bought a Sterling, which was the other half of a j/v with Acura. The Japanese had one marketing plan, the British had another, and well, nobody’s ever heard of Sterling, but I.drove one because they got to market first. Identical to the first Acura except for the badge. Car companies change, competition does exist, and this is no different.

Good point Leap, they can copy it but the problem is they are hampered by their legacy business, it’s acting like a weight around their neck and they are running out of time. Once Tesla gets their solar business profitable and then gets FSD up and running its Game Set Match. The race is on.

Andy

1 Like

My guessing machine is in the shop for updates… :innocent:

Some time ago, maybe one or two quarters ago, Musk announced the development of a new platform for the mass market EV stating that the goal was a 50% production cost reduction. That does not sound like a stripped down version of current models. Several years ago Musk asked, why not make real cars like we make toy cars, cast in one piece? Since then the giga-presses have grown in size now to 9,000 ton press. The first use of the 6,000 ton giga-presses was to make two part front and rear castings. Next they were replaced by single piece front and rear castings still using the 6,000 ton giga-presses. A 9,000 ton giga-press is being assemble in Austin, TX, to build the Cybertruck underbody.

My guesstimate is that the underbody of the new platform will be a single piece casting replacing the three piece model Y underbody, front, rear, and battery pack tray all in one piece. I also wonder how the Cyber-truck stainless steel body will influence the new platform. For cost analysis it’s best to follow Sandy Munro. The latest:

Sandy Munro: How Tesla Gets To The $24,000 Car

The Captain

6 Likes

Are there any projections on that?

DB2

This is basically the frame, correct? One giant piece, made a once, instead of multiple pieces that then get bolted, and maybe welded together. I remember when Chevy developed the C5 Corvette and its hydro formed frame rails. It was a big deal, back then, to hydroform something that large. It cut down the number of individual pieces to the frame by a lot, and with it all of the variabilities in frame dimensions, the exact placements of bolted/welded pieces, and the flex that comes along with that. One piece, less flex, less variation! These castings take this to a new level.

I cannot recommend “All Corvettes Are Red” enough! Great story in how the C5 came about, and an excellent read on what it takes to bring ANY new car to market. Very relevant to this discussion!

2 Likes

Not that I know of DB2 But this is what Kirkhorn had to say on the last CC.

"Partially offsetting these impacts, we’ve continued to execute on Tesla controllable cost reductions, in line with the progress we’ve made in prior years. These improvements include our continued work to gradually move towards a regionally balanced build of vehicles.

The Energy business had its strongest year yet across all metrics, led by steady improvement in both retail and commercial storage. While much work remains to grow this business and improve costs, we believe we are on a good trajectory.

As we look towards 2023, we are moving forward aggressively leveraging our strength and cost. There are three key points I wanted to make here. First, on demand, as Elon mentioned, customer interest in our products remains high. Second, on cost reduction, we’re holding steady on our plans to rapidly increase volume, while improving overhead efficiency, which is the most effective method to retain strength in our operating margins."

They are trying to maintain OM so if I understand that statement correctly they are going to try and improve the Margins on the Solar division but how much and how soon isn’t clear.

Andy

2 Likes

That doesn’t sound like something shipping in 2024!

1 Like

Maybe not, it’s one thing to develop the platform and another to set up the production line. Musk has repeatedly said that production is hard.

The Captain

1 Like

Production is not that hard. ALL the “pre-production” stuff takes time to “get it right”.

Use Twitter to set Musk straight! :imp:

The Captain

3 Likes

Andy,

The problem with those opinions you are mixing in wishful thinking…about the future. Some of the things the competition will do will be successful.

3 Likes

Everyone else is…They are all in my way… :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

You sure it’s not you mixing fantasy with wishful thinking? I would rather put my future in the hands of Elon than Mary, Jim, Timothy, Akio, or any of the other CEO’s you are betting on. Only one of those ceo’s (Elon) has ever shown any amount of imagination.

Andy

1 Like

I am not betting on any of them. Why would I own a car company?

Never mind a car company owned by Christ! Or other car companies owned by the disciples?

The auto industry is too capital intensive for my blood.

I do not like any car company when it is valued well over $1 trillion. I do not like any car company valued at $500 billion.

Common sense…which is not so common.

I do like the future of EVs if that helps.

Your killing me Leap, so you are here just for the sake of the argument. :joy: :joy:

Andy

2 Likes

yes :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

You are catching on!!

Seriously I am sharpening my knives on what I want to value corporations in general. I am here for a general discussion.

And to stick it to you Andy. :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

Consider me stuck :joy: :joy:

Andy

2 Likes

Elon still can’t find a way to make a good supply of spare parts for when his cars break, or get in accidents. In other words, Tesla is still not a mature car company. I’ll buy a Mach-E or an ID.4, thank you, and not worry about fender benders keeping me out of commission for a long time.

3 Likes