INBK

Hello Saul,

This is a great investment forum. In an effort to contribute, I have applied some of the banking experience in my past to look at BOFI and INBK. My conclusion on BOFI is that Fletch has provided ample support for investment there. I have recently added BOFI to my own portfolio.

INBK is, IMO, lacking the necessary criteria for investment. Here are the main reasons for this belief:

  1. INBK has shown no growth in recent earnings. Net income for the past three years in million dollars – 2014-4.32 2013-4.59 2012-5.61 This is distressing in its own right, but in Q4 of 2013 INBK added $29.1 Mil.
    (48%) in capital via a stock offering. Management had this additional 48% available during all of 2014 and “managed” to decrease earnings by 6%?

  2. The rationale for a branchless bank is straight-forward; the bank can deliver services to customers (and returns to shareholders) more efficiently by using the internet as the customer interface. The bank’s costs are reduced by not capitalizing or maintaining the bricks and mortar, and more importantly, by eliminating tellers, branch managers and their assistants and support staff. The bank’s capital is more productive as it can be deployed in true earning assets rather than real estate symbols of prosperity and solidarity. How can we validate this efficiency? The metric of efficiency is called the efficiency ratio. (Old time bankers did not have to work as hard as the government to name things) This is operating costs excluding interest costs divided by revenue. Here is INBK’s trend: 2014-76.92 2013-75.86; 2012-60.93. Lower is better, so INBK is going in the wrong direction. More serious, however, is that they have been in business more than 15 years and their efficiency ratio exceeds most of the traditional branch banking systems. What grade would you give management here?

3.Despite being fraught with risk and regulation, banking can be a very good business. This is because banks have compound interest on their side. Good returns come from come from the spread earned on assets above the costs of funds to acquire the assets. The common measures of management’s effectiveness in producing acceptable returns are the Net Interest Margin and the Allowance for loan losses (or securities losses if applicable). Both BOFI and INBK are exhibiting rapid loan growth. In this case, it is hard to rely on Allowances for Loan losses as losses take some time to be realized in a banking portfolio. Investigation of other metrics that give early indications of probable loan losses such as credit scores in consumer lending and loan to value rations in asset lending would indicate that both of these banks enjoy high credit quality. Then how about Net Interest Margin? For INBK 2014-2.65 2013-2.67 2012-2.67. For BOFI, most recent 3.95. Therefore, IF the credit quality is similar, BOFI is receiving nearly 50% more revenue on every dollar that it loans, and it loans a LOT more dollars. Why is this disparity present here? Early on, INBK was a residential mortgage banker primarily. They found this industry crowded and cyclical as well as highly regulated. Returns were problematic during housing downturns. INBK developed a specialty niche- lending on rv’s and horsetrailers. They had help from dealers in generating these credits. The loans were very high quality. Not many unemployed or homeless could afford horses or RVs. However, the only way to grow this business was to give attractive terms to the borrowers and even then, borrowers were hard to find in the volume desired. INBK then turned to commercial real estate as a way to grow loans. Being risk averse, they jumped into the area of credit tenant leased real estate. Think of a building occupied by McDonalds or Taco Bell on a long term lease. With proper loan to value standards, certainly a safer loan than many as far as risk of the business failing. This is where INBK has generated loan growth in the recent past. How do you think they generated this growth from the borrower’s perspective? Having been there, done that, I can tell you that these borrowers have many lender options. Where they actually borrow the money simply depends on who offers the best terms. Rate or rate/amortization, that is most meaningful to the borrower. Therefore, a lender that will accept a lower rate, or a longer term of amortization or better yet, a lower fixed rate with a longer amortization can get a LOT of business. Has INBK done this? YES, and that will certainly show growth in loans. In spite of this new lending niche, INBK could not attain their desired growth in loans last year through the origination process. 57% of last year’s loan growth was purchased from others.

When I look at INBK, I do not give management high grades. I see evidence of risk aversion that you desire in a bank management, but I see a disturbing history of a lack of perspective concerning how to relate risk to return and how to employ structural cost advantages to the benefit of customers and shareholders. At BOFI it is just the opposite. Management at BOFI has demonstrated cost control and scale leverage, along with a risk/reward understanding in the acquisition of earning assets. Folks like to talk sometimes about the efficient market theory. As BOFI is priced by the market at about 3 times book value and INBK at 80% of book value, I think the market is undervaluing BOFI.

In closing, I would like to state that I have a great deal of admiration for Anirban who teaches us all many things about investing.
To you, Anirban, I would ask the following: In an industry that is beset with the creative destruction of the digital age, why would you invest in a company founded by an IT guy who knows little about banking instead of one founded by a banker who knows how to acquire IT expertise?

24 Likes

Thanks creelon for the post. Its good to hear bear arguments.

I just have a few comments and clarifications to offer.

  1. With respect to
    INBK has shown no growth in recent earnings.

This is factually inaccurate. The last four earnings show solid growth:

12/14: $0.32
09/14: $0.28
06/14: $0.22
03/14: $0.13

Yes, I agree if one looks at the past three years then it appears that they have not grown much, but one needs to look under the hood. The bank has been steadily transformed over the past three years, going from an operation that was lending to RVs and horse trailer to one that does pretty much all types of lending.

  1. With respect to the point regarding net interest margin, I think we should be looking at net interest income, non-interest income, and non-interest income. I will cut and paste what I said earlier:

Net Interest income (‘000):
12/14: 6,375
09/14: 5,673
06/14: 5,373
03/14: 4,866
12/13: 4,964

Non-interest income (‘000):
12/14: 2,098
09/14: 1,943
06/14: 1,622
03/14: 1,511
12/13: 1,171

Non-interest expenses (‘000):
12/14: 5,879
09/14: 5,785
06/14: 5,560
03/14: 5,438
12/13: 5,255

Cash efficiency ratios
———————————
12/14: 0.69 (Q4 14)
09/14: 0.76 (Q3 14)
06/14: 0.79 (Q2 14)
03/14: 0.85 (Q1 14)
12/13: 0.86 (Q4 13)

Last quarter, we had an interesting discussion regarding INBK still working like a refinance shop and that it wasn’t making any monies from it’s real business of making out loans. In one of the posts, I had said the following:

If we just look at the net interest income for the just reported quarter, then it would appear that the bank is mostly earning monies from non-interest income activities because the non-interest expense is just as large as the net interest income. But, if we look at the trend, then we will notice that non-interest expense (“operating expenses”) have been flat-lining at least over the past four quarters. In fact, non-interest expense has grown only by 4% b/w 06/13 and 09/14. In the same time period, however, net interest income (i.e., income from the loans) has grown by 34%. If this trend is to hold, then any additional loan book growth should drop directly into the bottom-line. Increase in non-interest income is just the icing on the cake.

The flat-lining of the expenses seems to be aligning nicely with what management has been doing. The bank raised money by selling shares, used these funds to go on a hiring spree to give a boast to its commercial lending activities. So, I think this strategy is working, and we are probably sitting at a crucial junction. If the loan book growth continues at the rate it is, then we should be seeing a very bright Q4.

Then, I had gone on to make the argument that the costs are likely to be flatlining and this should essentially have a trickle down effect on the earnings. Well, I guess I ‘m happy to see the thesis play out as I was expecting it to play out. This is what I had noted in one of the discussions:

Related to my point above, if the expenses stay relatively flat as they have over the past four quarters, then the increases in the loan book would have trickle down effect on the bottomline, which in turn should bring the efficiency measure down. Is a 65% efficiency measure possible by the end of the year?

INBK didn’t quite get to my ambitious target of hitting 65% efficiency ratio, but it did bring the efficiency ratio down to 69%, with interest income being now greater than non-interest expense, so non-interest income is gravy. I think it’s made very nice progress.

  1. To you, Anirban, I would ask the following: In an industry that is beset with the creative destruction of the digital age, why would you invest in a company founded by an IT guy who knows little about banking instead of one founded by a banker who knows how to acquire IT expertise?

I actually quite like the INBK management team. The CEO has serious skin in the game. They are conservative in the loans they hand out, and they take a slow and steady approach. In this case, I do believe that slow & steady can win the race! Also, Becker has hired bankers to work alongside him to scale the business and early signs are that its working. I also like that the fact that INBK is selling at a significant discount to book value (I like downside protection) and is pretty much under the radar. I think about two analysts follow the company and the trading volume is low.

I am a patient investor and I like to invest along with management who have significant skin in the game. As long as the keep meeting my expectation of business expansion, I 'm fine holding INBK. It’s one of my largest holdings and also one of my highest conviction ones.

I also hold BOFI but I 'm not buying at 3x book value. I look to buy opportunistically at around 2x book value and otherwise write puts to buy it lower.

Anyways, that’s what I do but this is not an investment advice as I 'm no investment advisor.

Anirban

10 Likes

Hello Anirban,

I will do my best to respond to your excellent comments:
Its good to hear bear arguments

In the sense that a bear view is one who expects the stock price to go down, that was not my message. I believe that INBK as a stock has value because of its price/book and because the management will evolve to show improvement. I was writing in the context of Saul’s stated goals of discovering long-term investments that could attain 30%+ appreciation. I do not believe that INBK will do that for long, if ever.
If I can stay awake longer, I will come back to further reasoning here, but I want to respond to your points first.

1) With respect to
INBK has shown no growth in recent earnings.

This is factually inaccurate. The last four earnings show solid growth:

you are correct, I should have said, “Based on annual earnings…”

Yes, I agree if one looks at the past three years then it appears that they have not grown much, but one needs to look under the hood. The bank has been steadily transformed over the past three years, going from an operation that was lending to RVs and horse trailer to one that does pretty much all types of lending

I was referring to income and it has not grown at all over the past three year period, but has declined. The bank still loans on horse trailers and RVs and still makes single family residential loans which has always been a more active part of their lending than horse trailers and RVs in dollar volume.

2) With respect to the point regarding net interest margin, I think we should be looking at net interest income, non-interest income, and non-interest income. I will cut and paste what I said earlier:

You are correct, I believe, in discerning this trend. I suspect that for a few quarters this will be a bright spot in the “turnaround” of INBK. More later on this when I have finished the direct response.

I actually quite like the INBK management team. The CEO has serious skin in the game. They are conservative in the loans they hand out, and they take a slow and steady approach. In this case, I do believe that slow & steady can win the race! Also, Becker has hired bankers to work alongside him to scale the business and early signs are that its working. I also like that the fact that INBK is selling at a significant discount to book value (I like downside protection)…

The CEO does have serious skin in the game. They are conservative, perhaps even slow and steady. You earlier commented that the bank has been steadily transformed over the past three years. I think that a part of my thesis is that Becker started the bank more than 15 years ago, why did this transformation not begin sooner? More to the point here, how does the fact that it did not start sooner impact whether or not INBK will satisfy Saul’s investment criteria? Outsized growth over the long term in banking will require a significant amount of capital.
Last year INBK paid out 25% of its earnings in dividends to shareholders. They successfully raised 29.1 million in a stock offering in Q4 of 2013. I submit that paying dividends and selling stock at less than book value is dilutive to shareholders much more so than selling stock for 3 times book value and curtailing dividends in favor of faster growth. I believe that BOFI has been much, much better managed. I was very hesitant to pay three times book value to invest in BOFI but it appears to me that they have executed superbly to this point and that there is serious value in their operating mode. When one looks at the trillions of deposits in traditional banking institutions, the lethargy in the good old boys banking structure, the portability of deposits, and the very pervasive attitude of hostility toward traditional bankers, it seems to me that the digital age will spawn a revolution that will create a long, long runway for BOFI. I am not so confident that INBK will fully participate in that long runway. IF they remain conservative, they may benefit from the huge growth umbrella that BOFI will place over “internet banks”.

Incidentally, I believe that BOFI will not sustain a price-book around 3 for a long period of time. I believe that the premium over book will maintain as long as the growth occurs at an inordinate rate, but will narrow gradually until the next recession when it will disappear rapidly and not recover unless BOFI demonstrates that its operating mode works better even in a recession.

I wish you all the best with your investment in INBK. As I said earlier, you have my respect for your investing acumen and diligence. I believe that Saul might even admit that INBK does not well fit his criteria, but he has so much respect for you that he instituted a small position. Also no investment advisor here,

Mike

9 Likes

I love MF and Saul’s Investing Discussions is terrific. Thanks to creelon and Anirban for this exchange. I’m long BOFI and have added steadily through all the"book value concerns" (though haven’t added this year). Probably will take a starter position in INBK as I need to deploy my Required Minimum Distribution. Thanks again,

KC

Mike,

Excellent points.

Okay, so my simplified view is the following.

Step 1 for INBK was to have systems in place to scale the operations. That’s been happening along with the diversification in the loan base, and they have been steadily growing the deposit base. Right now, the loans and deposits base seem to go hand in hand.

Step 2 would be to take advantage of operating efficiencies, grow deposits to drive loan growth, dropping more monies to the bottomline. The operating efficiency has increased in the past few quarters. E.g., the non-interest expense has more or less flatlined. I would expect earnings to show solid growth for a while.

Steps 1 & 2 should get them increased street cred, increased institutional holdings, and boast multiple. The dividends were initiated partially I beleive to attract certain types of institutional investors. Multiple boast along with earnings growth will drive the stock price up making it attractive to use equity to fund growth. This would be Step 3.

I know the bank has been around for a while and I don’t know why Becker didn’t try to push the bank earlier. However, I like how they are going about doing business. I like how management bought shares when the stock was at 0.7 book value and they haven’t sold.

Overall, the opportunity for Internet banking is big and wide. I would think there can be multiple winners in this, and don’t really see a winner take all type playbook.

Anirban.

2 Likes

Hi creelon, Here’s how I see it. INBK took a big hit a year and a half ago when refinancing dried up (fairly suddenly), and their earnings plunged (bolded below). Here’s what the quarterly earnings looked like:

2013: xx 38 16 19
2014: 13 22 28 32
2015:

You can see that they’ve been doing a pretty good job of pulling themselves out of a hole since then (13, 22, 28, 32).

Now, a cursory glance will show you that (barring unforeseen catastrophe), their earnings should be up a minimum of 100% for the quarter we just finished, and possibly considerably more. They will also be up at least 75% for the June quarter.

Now, while I’m reluctant to take a big position due to it being a tiny company with severe lack of liquidity, I’d also be very, VERY, reluctant to short a stock like that, with the same severe lack of liquidity, 100% gains in earnings coming, and selling at less than book value.

Just saying, in case you were considering (or are already in) a short position.

Saul

3 Likes

By the way, I do agree with you creelon, that BOFI is a better and safer pick right now, because of it’s consistency, better efficiency ratio, etc, and that INBK is a bit of a speculation, and I’m treating it at such. However I think you are being a bit disingenuous in presenting three-year results (2012,2013,2014) to show a downtrend on a company that has reinvented itself in the past year and is showing rather remarkable improvements in their metrics (earnings, efficiency ratio, etc). What happened in 2012 seems to have limited relevance to what they are doing now (their business didn’t crash until Sept quarter of 2013, and it’s been a reinvented business since then). However if you don’t like the company, there are plenty of others out there.

Best,

Saul

1 Like

This discussion between Mike and Anirban comparing INBK and BOFI is a classic example of why this board is a cut above the rest.

I for one appreciate the in depth classy analysis being shared for the edification of us all.

Thanks, guys, for sharing your hard work and time with us all.

Jim

9 Likes

Hello Anirban,

Overall, the opportunity for Internet banking is big and wide. I would think there can be multiple winners in this, and don’t really see a winner take all type playbook.

I certainly agree with that statement. I think that we can both agree
that winning can be a relative term in this instance and also, that an important part of winning is not losing. By buying below book value, you have given yourself a greater margin of safety. You should consider that in banking the book value represents the regulatory view of whether there is sufficient capital in the business. The true margin of safety for the depositor is somewhat bolstered by the regulator. The margin of safety for the shareholder is to have the bank provide service that customers desire at a price that delivers a profit to shareholders. The depositor is anchored by service and can flee the bank whenever the service is unsatisfactory. Nothing will cause them to flee faster than losses and the resulting fear that their deposits are not safe. The problem with the horse trailer loans is not that they may not get paid back, it is that it is difficult to scale meaningful volume at rates that will increase the bank’s spread.

As far as Becker et al, I hope the dividend institution was to attract
institutional investors rather than put cash into the pockets of the bank’s largest shareholder. I know that you will diligently follow their progress.

Best regards,

Mike

2 Likes

Hello Saul,

Now, while I’m reluctant to take a big position due to it being a tiny company with severe lack of liquidity, I’d also be very, VERY, reluctant to short a stock like that, with the same severe lack of liquidity, 100% gains in earnings coming, and selling at less than book value.

Just saying, in case you were considering (or are already in) a short position

I thought I have made it clear that I don’t think the stock price of INBK will go down in the near term. I don’t short stocks, sometimes I short put options on shares that I want to accumulate but am not in a hurry to own.

Were you trying to compliment my acumen by asking me if I was shorting a stock with such wide market spreads, tiny volume, and such excellent near-term prospects?

Best,

Mike

Hello Saul,

By the way, I do agree with you creelon, that BOFI is a better and safer pick right now, because of it’s consistency, better efficiency ratio, etc, and that INBK is a bit of a speculation, and I’m treating it at such. However I think you are being a bit disingenuous in presenting three-year results (2012,2013,2014) to show a downtrend on a company that has reinvented itself in the past year and is showing rather remarkable improvements in their metrics (earnings, efficiency ratio, etc). What happened in 2012 seems to have limited relevance to what they are doing now (their business didn’t crash until Sept quarter of 2013, and it’s been a reinvented business since then). However if you don’t like the company, there are plenty of others out there.

My main theme was that while INBK is conservative in their loan underwriting standards that the management has not thus far demonstrated ability to perform over the long run. I did not say that a speculation that they are improving based on the last few quarters of data was unsound. It is in my memory that Saul wanted to see where there was a runway to grow his investments 3 times or more over 3 years. I am sure that you realize that getting INBK to a premium over book value will not by itself accomplish that. When interest rates do begin to go back up, their lower rates on the loan portfolio, (much of which is fixed for years into the future) will present them with an ugly headwind. There will be ample time for a nimble investor such as yourself to sell and move on, hopefully, for a good profit.

What I am trying to understand is whether or not you think that INBK meets the criteria you have posted relative to your investments? It seems that you recognize it is a turnaround story, that it is a speculation, that it is illiquid. Do you believe that there is true potential to triple or better your investment in the next 3 years? Or do you classify this as a small speculation, justified as an exception from the criteria such as AMAVF?

Just trying to better understand… thanks again for having this forum,

Mike

1 Like

Hi Mike, I guess it was obvious that INBK was not a short candidate. Didn’t mean to insult your intelligence. (Although if you look at your favorite stock of all, whatever it is, that you are sure will be moving up, I’m sure you will find there are some people short it). Sorry, I guess I was just mentioning it out of concern for your wallet, rather than your intelligence.

:wink:

Saul

PS It’s a curious phenomenon, isn’t it. If you look at your highest conviction stock, or mine, or anirban’s or David G’s, there will always be people short it. It makes you wonder what makes them see it so differently, or are their goals different (trying to make a few dollars on a two day trade on a stock they think is temporarily overbought, for example), but it is very curious.

Saul

PSS. INBK is an example, perhaps. While it’s not one of mine, I think it’s one of anirban’s high conviction stocks, and you see it completely differently, and you are both smart, and have both analyzed it extensively. For me, as you suggest here:

What I am trying to understand is whether or not you think that INBK meets the criteria you have posted relative to your investments? It seems that you recognize it is a turnaround story, that it is a speculation, that it is illiquid. Do you believe that there is true potential to triple or better your investment in the next 3 years? Or do you classify this as a small speculation, justified as an exception from the criteria such as AMAVF?

I think of it as an exception, a special situation, which as you said, is a small speculation in a turnaround. I see their 2015 earnings up a lot, and I don’t see interest rates going up much in 2015, if at all, which seems to be one of the big things that concern you about it. (I don’t know ANYTHING about interest rates, but here’s my common sense analysis:

  1. There is zero effective inflation, which gives no motivation to raise rates except ideological reasons (which could actually win out, I admit).

  2. The dollar has risen enormously against the Euro and most other currencies, which will start to cause trouble for our exporters. Raising interest rates, will only make the dollar stronger, and exacerbate the problem.

  3. The strong dollar is keeping our imports very cheap, which keeps down inflation, and will keep it down for the foreseeable future.

  4. Even with all the stimulus, the Federal deficit has been coming down every year for the last 5-6 years, and is now at perfectly normal and sustainable levels.

  5. Finally, there is a good chance that raising interest rates significantly would choke off the rise in the economy.

Sure the Federal Reserve could do it, could raise interest rates, and may take a meaningless tiny baby step just to show everyone they can do it if they want to, but why in the world would anyone want them to do it?

So I don’t see INBK in much danger from sharply rising interest rates any time in the next year or two.

Hope this helps.

Saul

5 Likes

Hello Saul,

Thank you very much, now I understand! I agree that it seems it would be folly for the Fed to raise rates soon but the day will come and when it does, it will create headwinds for the entire market, not just some banks.

Best,

Mike

1 Like

but the day will come and when it does, it will create headwinds for the entire market, not just some banks.

Hi again Mike. I read somewhere that the market continues to rise for at least two years after interest rates start up (as they reflect a strong economy). Here’s a quote from the WSJ:

And that rise, when it comes, will be a good thing, investment professionals are saying, since the Fed will raise interest rates only when it is confident that the economic recovery is robust and companies have regained the ability to raise prices.

Furthermore, investment firms point out, stocks have done well in past periods of rising interest rates, gaining an average of up to 8% or 10% annually, depending on the measurement period and how Fed policy is defined. The highest returns have tended to occur when rates have risen gradually from low levels during periods of negligible inflation, much like conditions today.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/fed-up-how-will-rising-interest-…

They then discuss a disagreeing opinion too, but that’s the stock market.

Saul

2 Likes

Hello Saul,

I guess that I am of the old school that equates stock values to a cash flow discounted by an interest rate. When the interest rate is increased the present value decreases because of the time value of money. I also believe that the market is buoyed today by the fact that there are few alternatives satisfactory for savers to park cash. Once rates rise, savers will have other alternatives.

I am reminded of the story of Einstein’s passing where he was met by St. Peter at the Golden Gate and informed that in order to make Heaven more enjoyable for him he would be able to see the IQ of people he met there by simply looking at it displayed on their forehead. (only readable by him) As he met successive folks with IQs of 170 (I bet you are a physicist, we can discuss the theory of relativity) and so forth down to 80 ( Oh, you are an economist, where do you see interest rates headed?)

I believe, as you have expressed, that one should stay fully invested and not attempt to time the market. In that regard, it is not necessary to determine when rates will rise, but what adjustments might one make when they do.

Best,

Mike

4 Likes