**How to Handle Required Withdrawals From Retirement Accounts** **By Glenn Ruffenach, The Wall Street Journal, Sept. 4, 2022**
**...** **Required withdrawals from a retirement account in a calendar year are based on the account’s ending balance in the prior year. So, the size of your RMD in 2022 was set on Dec. 31, 2021....The IRS isn’t “making” you sell stocks. To begin, you can use cash in your IRA — if you have it — to satisfy your RMD...**
**But let’s say all your IRA assets are invested in the markets. You don’t have to sell investments to meet your RMD; rather, the transaction can take place “in kind.” If your RMD is $10,000, you can transfer — and that’s the key word: transfer — $10,000 of XYZ stock from your IRA to a taxable brokerage account. This transfer counts for your RMD. Yes, you will pay tax on the value of the stock (or stock fund) on the date the assets leave your IRA. And that value becomes your new “cost basis” if and when you sell the stock that’s now sitting in your taxable account.**
**Again, the point is: You haven’t “sold” anything — and certainly not at today’s depressed prices. You still own the assets; you’re simply holding them outside your IRA instead of inside....**
**With the required withdrawal now sitting in a non-IRA account, “buy and hold” can work in your favor. If you hold the assets more than one year, any appreciation will be taxed, favorably, as long-term capital gains. By contrast, withdrawals from IRAs are taxed at ordinary income-tax rates....** [end quote]
This might be a good way to get capital gains tax rates on stocks that have appreciated in an IRA even if the transfer from the IRA to the regular account isn’t due to a RMD.
Whether you take an IRA withdrawal in cash or in kind (by getting stock) the tax on the withdrawal is the same.
If you do take an in kind withdrawal, your basis in the stock is it’s value on the date withdrawn and that is also when the holding period begins. Just like if you bought the stock for cash on that day.
The only difference is going to be in transaction fees. There might be fees to sell in the IRA, to make a cash or in kind withdrawal, to receive stock into your regular brokerage account, or to buy the stock in your brokerage account.
There might also be some risk of the stock moving in price between the sell in the IRA and the buy in your brokerage. What that risk might be will depend a lot in the specific stock and the market in general.
In short, there’s nothing to see here. This isn’t new, it’s been available for decades.
If you want a real tax break on your RMDs from an IRA, look at qualified charitable distributions.
You can make a distribution directly from your IRA to a charity and not have to report the withdrawal as income. This has the advantage of keeping your AGI lower, which can help with things like IRMAA increases to your Medicare premiums or itemized deductions for medical expenses.
For those who don’t itemize deductions, a QCD basically gives you a full deduction by keeping the withdrawal out of your income.
IMHO, this is one of the most overlooked tax breaks for older taxpayers.
This might be a good way to get capital gains tax rates on stocks that have appreciated in an IRA even if the transfer from the IRA to the regular account isn’t due to a RMD.
You’ve already heard the facts from a professional, ptheland, but the problem with this conclusion is too big for me to ignore. Everything that comes out of a traditional IRA, whether for RMD or not, is taxed as regular income. That includes the appreciation within the IRA, it will be taxed as income! ptheland covered the one exception, Qualified Charitable Distributions, in his second post. Of course that only saves on taxes because you gave it away!
Everything that comes out of a traditional IRA, whether for RMD or not, is taxed as regular income. That includes the appreciation within the IRA, it will be taxed as income!
And this is why opportunistic Roth IRA conversions are worth considering.
If there’s a low-income window between when you stop earning a paycheck and when you start taking ‘mandatory income’ like Social Security, RMDs, or pensions, that is a great chance to get a chunk of your retirement savings rolled to a Roth IRA at a lower tax/total cost burden.
Of course that only saves on taxes because you gave it away!
Quite a few of my clients engage in some form of charitable giving. If that is something you are inclined to do, it makes sense to do it in the most tax efficient way possible.
I should also point our another consideration for any estate you might have. When thinking about your estate, if you are going to leave part of your estate to charity, it makes sense to do that through your IRA. A charity will not have to pay income tax on that money, but your children/grandchildren/other heirs would. Those heirs will get a step up in basis for any other inherited assets, so all of those gains would escape taxation as well.
You can control the details by naming the charity or group of charities as the beneficiary of your IRA. Since you can have multiple IRA accounts, put the charity on one and your other heirs on another. You can adjust the split by transferring money from one to the other during your lifetime.
This isn’t an original thought of mine. I saw it recently on the estate planning board. I encourage people to read the original post there, as I’m sure the original did a much better job of explaining it than I have here.
IMHO, this is one of the most overlooked tax breaks for older taxpayers.
I would agree, but I would also point out that QCDs are no longer a thing just for those eligible for RMDs. QCDs are allowed starting at age 70 1/2 (the previous age for RMDs), while RMDs don’t currently start until age 72. (And there is pending legislation raising the RMD age to 75.)
If you want a real tax break on your RMDs from an IRA, look at qualified charitable distributions.
Any idea if the QCD can be made on a weekly basis? I guess the Church doesn’t care but it would seem to me they would want their income smoothed or spread over the year to meet routine expenses rather than a lump sum.
So, the size of your RMD in 2022 was set on Dec. 31, 2021…The IRS isn’t “making” you sell stocks. To begin, you can use cash in your IRA — if you have it — to satisfy your RMD…
If you know that your IRA will have RMDs in the near future* (or non-required distributions, but you’re just taking money out to live on), why would you hold 100% of the money in volatile assets? If you hold some cash or CDs, you can sell that instead of stocks. You know well in advance what the percent will be for your RMD, so you can plan around that. Plus, the last few RMD changes have been “pleasant” ones–raising the RMD age, adjusting the percents to account for longer life expectancy.
*Near Future = The time frame where stocks (or whatever your assets are) are subject to high volatility.
<Since you can have multiple IRA accounts, put the charity on one and your other heirs on another. You can adjust the split by transferring money from one to the other during your lifetime. >
How about having a single IRA with a primary beneficiary (spouse) and multiple contingent beneficiaries (including charities) with different percentages? Would that work? It’s less effort than maintaining multiple separate IRA accounts.
“If there’s a low-income window between when you stop earning a paycheck and when you start taking ‘mandatory income’ like Social Security, RMDs, or pensions, that is a great chance to get a chunk of your retirement savings rolled to a Roth IRA at a lower tax/total cost burden.”
Can I please get opinion from this board? 40% of my Retirement accounts are in Roth and 60% Non-Roth at present. Recently retired, 55yo and no plans on withdrawing these funds until required. Would you all soon convert any/ all of the Non-Roth assets to Roth or keep things status quo? Income will substantially drop in 2023. Never a fan of taxes but willing to consider what is best for the long run if logical and consequential. Thanks in advance!
If you’re lucky, you’ll get an answer that’s somewhere in the neighborhood of “it depends”.
It depends on how big a nest egg you’re dealing with, whether you have money outside your retirement accounts to pay your conversion taxes from, whether you can take advantage of the age 55 withdrawal rules or any NUA rules from your former employer’s employer-sponsored retirement accounts, and a whole host of other factors. One of which is your estate plan, and another of which is your plan for any long-term nursing home care.
My personal target is to keep my RMDs at or below the cash flow level I’ll need to cover my basic expenses in retirement, after accounting for Social Security and Medicare. Predicting the future on that is as much art as it is science… Still, unless 2022 is the start of a long-term trend of skyrocketing inflation and lousy market returns, there is a decent chance that I will end up doing some Roth conversions in the window between when I stop working and start taking RMDs.
WEBspired,
This is very much a personal decision that only you know the entire financial picture of.
Pro’s - Reasons to do some conversions.
Lower income years allow you to convert some without getting slammed by taxes.
Lower stock prices like we have now are another reason to do some conversions.
You said 2023 will be a lower income. Good time to plan some conversions.
What about 2024, 2025 etc?
Keep an eye on your income and planned tax rates each year.
Social Security-Medicare, Once you start Medicare and or Social Security the tax picture changes.
Your MAGI each year will determine how much your SSA Benefits are taxed. Also the MAGI will determine if you will be paying IRMAA penalties for Medicare Premiums.
If Married you have to look for combined incomes and taxes.
If you have a Traditional Pension, that will affect MAGI also.
Con’s - Reasons to not do conversions.
Income and Taxes are in a higher tax bracket now and will be lower in future years.
You don’t have a pension or other income so RMD’s will keep you in a low enough tax bracket in the future. The smaller the IRA is the more chance this will be the case.
two last item2.- 1. You said you don’t plan on needing the Retirement funds for many years. That means you either have other income which affects your decision. Or you have Taxable Investment accounts that you plan to live on.
2. This year the MAGI level which causes IRMAA and higher tax brackets is about 180K for Married - and I think about 85K for Single. Do a what if exercise to see get an idea of RMD Balance of all IRA’s on year end, and look up what the RMD would be at 72. If that + your projected SSA Benefits gets you close to the IRMAA levels then look to do more conversions.
Its a moving target where all the pieces change value, and tax laws also change which makes it difficult to get it just right.
How about having a single IRA with a primary beneficiary (spouse) and multiple contingent beneficiaries (including charities) with different percentages? Would that work?
Sure. If you wanted to give a percentage of your estate to charity, it would be fine.
On the other hand, if you want to make a gift of a specific dollar amount, you’d need to constantly tweak the beneficiary designations. Most IRA custodians insist on percentages in beneficiary designations rather than dollar amounts.
I can’t speak for churches, but I would imagine just about anyone would prefer to receive full payment up front. The danger with recurring payments is that the donor might stop at some point if they feel the monthly obligations become too much.
Think of it in terms of the lottery. If you won $5m, would you take it as a lump sum payment or in 30 years of monthly installments? Almost everyone picks the lump sum, because you want the money in your pocket right away. You can then invest it, or do whatever you want with it. It makes it easier to budget because you know up front how much money you have to spend, and you don’t have to base expenses on what you hope to have.
Even companies that offer monthly subscription services often offer a discount if you pay a full year up front. Because the would rather lock in your revenue than trust you to pay over time.
Fuskie
Who is a member of his local PBS radio/tv station, and after years of pushing monthly sustainable member subscriptions has recently been inviting members to pre-pay a full year’s membership, which once upon a time was just called an annual donation…
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I can’t speak for churches, but I would imagine just about anyone would prefer to receive full payment up front. The danger with recurring payments is that the donor might stop at some point if they feel the monthly obligations become too much.
I was treasurer for many years for a religious organization.
We had to keep records because contributions were tax-deductible even though many or our members did not itemize their deductions. Because some did. We were lucky because we did not need to file tax returns to the state or federal governments.
I would hate weekly contributions because I would have to make 52 entries in our books for each such member. Even monthly was a bit much. I would have preferred one big total payment at the beginning of the year from each member, but that was not our policy. I did not like cash contributions either, especially when they were anonymously put in the collection box. I could not credit them to anyone. I also kept track of regular attenders who made financial contributions
Requesting a full payment at the beginning of the year would have severe problems, I imagine.
We really needed about $1,500 a year from each member. I.e., a married couple would need to pay $3,000 a year. And actually, since some members paid nothing, those who did pay had to pay more than their fair share.
Thanks Mike and Chuck! I realize it’s not a straightforward answer without all information. My assets within the brokerage accounts are significantly more than my retirement accounts, so I was planning on slowly liquidating conservative equity securities and taking LTCG when necessary (and markets overbought) and when the cash of three or so years of annual expenses ultimately runs down. Unfortunately, we have no pension or other source of income other than the assets within the brokerage accounts.
I suppose we all must pay taxes at some point in time but the thought of the opportunity cost of the significant tax bill upon the conversion is difficult to swallow, but it may be easier if it is spread out over many years.
My wife and I do file jointly. We will hopefully stay within that 22% to 24% tax bracket starting in 2023 and beyond.
We really appreciate your interest and insight as we proceed, and we realize the need to do a good bit more research and reading. Glad that we found this interesting board as well. Many Thanks!
I can’t speak for churches, but I would imagine just about anyone would prefer to receive full payment up front.
I can speak a bit from both sides, having worked in development. Donor cultivation is an art and it is important to be sensitive to the wishes of the donor. I’m not talking about $20 checks here. If a donor is gifting a significant amount, just express gratitude.
40% of my Retirement accounts are in Roth and 60% Non-Roth at present. Recently retired, 55yo and no plans on withdrawing these funds until required. Would you all soon convert any/ all of the Non-Roth assets to Roth or keep things status quo?
I would first point out that if you have no intention of withdrawing any Roth money ‘until you have to’ you should be sure to transfer any Roth money in employer plans to an IRA before RMDs are required. That’s because employer Roth accounts have RMDs, while Roth IRAs don’t. So by moving any Roth money in employer plans to an IRA, you will avoid ‘having to’ withdraw any of it.
Also, I don’t think that you can make this decision without considering the account allocation of your entire portfolio, including your brokerage accounts, not just the retirement accounts, so that’s a big missing piece in your ask, so it’s not really possible to answer your question specifically.
Never a fan of taxes but willing to consider what is best for the long run if logical and consequential.
Here are some things to consider:
Absent any other legislation, the current 22% and 24% tax brackets are scheduled to increase to 25% and 28% as of 1/1/26. So 2023 - 2025 will be a great time to do conversions, into the 24% bracket, if you consider that you will actually be ‘staying within the 25% - 28%’ brackets after that under current law. Note that if you go into the 24% bracket, you will need to watch out for the 3.8% NIIT tax on investment income, which kicks in at $250k for MFJ.
You should be looking at what happens to the tax rate for the survivor when one of you die. While the survivor will get less total SS income, the limit at which SS is taxed at is also lower. If you are each other’s primary beneficiary on Traditional retirement accounts and are of a similar age to each other, the RMDs will continue to provide increasing income each year. So, between those two factors, it’s likely that the survivor will end up paying a higher percentage of their income as a single than you as a couple paid.
If you are self-funding for any long-term care, the medical costs over 7.5% of your income that are generated by the long-term care will be deductible on Schedule A. It’s more beneficial to have ordinary income (like from taxable SS and Traditional IRA withdrawals) that will be offset by those deductions than to use those deductions against capital gains. That makes an argument for keeping some money in Traditional accounts, even though they are subject to RMDs.
After both of you die, if you will be leaving your remaining Traditional accounts to a beneficiary other than a charity, that beneficiary will only have 10 years to empty out the accounts, with all of the withdrawals taxed at ordinary income rates. If the accounts contain a substantial amount, that could boost your beneficiary’s tax rate to a higher rate than you would have paid if you had withdrawn the money yourself. So if you want to have the lowest possible taxes paid on your Traditional accounts, it may be useful for you to make withdrawals yourself, especially if your beneficiaries are already in the 24%/28% bracket without income from your retirement accounts.
Any idea if the QCD can be made on a weekly basis?
The restriction is the minimum payment your IRA administrator permits. Quarterly would be more likely to meet the minimums. Church would likely prefer annual because the funds are in their hands and they can count on it.