Well that’s just the entire problem in a nutshell. The earth doesn’t care about borders, heck, if you look at earth from space, you can’t see any of those artificial borders. And furthermore, CO2 doesn’t care about borders, it distributes itself across any and all of those borders. So if China and India increase CO2 emissions by an extra million or two tons, and the USA and Europe reduce their CO2 emissions by 100,000 or 200,000 tons, then all the earth sees is an increase of somewhat less than a million or two tons. Still going heavily in the wrong direction.
And it’s not entirely true that other countries can’t do anything about it - one simple thing they (US, Australia, etc) could do is simply refuse to sell coal at low prices, making other forms of energy relatively cheaper than coal. Heck, they could put absolute caps on the total amount of coal they will sell, and have those caps go down each year for 20 years, until they reach close to zero.
You keep saying that yet you have been proven wrong again and again. If there was not reason to use a humanoid form for robots they would not be doing it. BMW no matter what you say is doing it.
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I mean - somewhat? China and India overwhelmingly use domestically produced coal. They do import some of their coal usage - but their largest source is Indonesia, followed by Russia for Chinese imports. India imports a fair amount of Aussie coal, but that percentage is expected to decline as domestic production continues to ramp faster than imports. If Oz curtailed their exports, that might trim Chindia coal usage a tiny bit, but not all that much.
People gamble on moonshot products and technology all the time. There wasn’t really a use case for the Segway (for example) - but they still did that. 3DTV, Google Glass, FB’s metaverse projects…lots of times “they” do things that they think/hope will make a ton of money or revolutionize an industry, and it just doesn’t. Sometimes for fairly predictable reasons.
Humanoid robots are cool. They look great in a pitch deck. They’re great for viral videos - so they’re enormously useful for recruiting talent and raising capital. Even if they end up having no commercial potential at all (like Asimo or Boston Dynamic’s Atlas). There’s absolutely no reason why BMW wouldn’t enter into a partnership to let Figure play around with their robots in their factory - positive PR for both firms, will make for some good investor video.
Worth perhaps mentioning that the BMW-Figure partnership calls into question whether Tesla has any real advantage in this stuff. IIRC, folks were saying that Tesla has a leg up on all the pure AI/robotics shops because they can try/teach these robots in their factories. But if all the other AI/robotics shop can do the same thing, then what’s the benefit to having this done in the same firm as a car company?
He was referring to the Amazon robots that Amazon actually deploys, rather than their experimental ones. Rather than try to move and lift things with a humanoid robot (basically a 2 meter vertical cylinder that has to engage in incredibly complicated balancing on two points), they just use a flat multi-wheeled robot with a low center of gravity:
It could be a lot of things, known or otherwise. Point being the only statements I have seen from knowledgeable sources acknowledge being on the autism spectrum with no mention of ADHD. Do you have a source that is actually about Musk?
The suggestion of no commercial potential seems ludicrous to me. Reason to have humanoid robots is because they will be asked to work in environments that are designed for humans. They will be assisting humans by doing jobs in the same workplace that are tedious, dangerous, or “robotic”. Amazon is in the process of testing humanoid robots made by Agility, a company it has invested in. Initially, Digit is being tested in older Amazon warehouses with narrow corridors designed more for humans than wheeled robotic platforms.
Agility is not yet ready to provide pricing information for Digit, but we’re told that it will cost less than $250,000 per unit. Even at that price, if Digit is able to achieve Agility’s goal of minimum 20,000 working hours (five years of two shifts of work per day), that brings the hourly rate of the robot to $12.50. A service contract would likely add a few dollars per hour to that. Humanoid Robots Are Getting to Work - IEEE Spectrum
If robots are going to work side by side with humans, sharing space designed for humans, then it makes sense to make them humanoid.
Three big advantages. The first is that Tesla is a production based company. It is not only developing Optimus, but is also developing the manufacturing process to mass-produce Optimus. As Musk has said, prototypes are easy, mass production is hard. The second is that Tesla has a lot of manufacturing positions that could be filled by a robot. Internal demand will facilitate Tesla scaling Optimus production while simultaneously reducing EV production costs. Third, there is an obvious overlap between the software used in FSD and Optimus. Synergy!
Don’t look now, but there are hundreds of thousands of robots working in environments designed for humans - which look nothing like humans. In fact, they are purpose built and better than humans for the purpose. No humanoid robot is going to swing windshields onto cars on an assembly line, nor run up and down Amazon warehouse aisles more efficiently than the floor-bots and similar they’re already using.
There may be a place for humanoid robots which have more versatility, for instance, cleaning up a nuclear accident, or perhaps walking around on the moon. Small segment, so far.
OK, but that presupposes a huge demand, which is questionable.
Do they? I recall Tesla having to call in the humans the last time they claimed to be automating everything.
If Tesla was miles ahead in the AI race then maybe. The overlap is not so obvious, particularly when they are working madly, and so far unsuccessfully, at getting FSD working to the point that it is ready for prime time.
No Tamhas because it is all speculation. Without a Doctor’s examination, which Musk probably wouldn’t release, it is always people speculating. I take it all with a grain of salt.
It is speculation. But it is very well-founded speculation because there exists TONS of footage of Musk over the years, and the odds are overwhelmingly high that he is indeed somewhere on the spectrum.
I am not a Doctor Mark, so I can’t say you are wrong.
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That wasn’t the point of that particular statement. I was replying to the suggestion that these things have to be useful, or people wouldn’t be building them. I was pointing out that people build stuff that they know isn’t useful, or that they mistakenly think will be useful and turns out not to be, all the time.
That said, Goofy’s point is well taken - robots work in human environments all the time without being shaped like a human. There’s almost no reason why a factory robot has to balance on a pair of tiny-surface feet, instead of having a broad base with wheels - if even it has to move at all. Being bipedal, instead of wheeled, is an advantage in environments that aren’t built for humans (like the outdoors) - if you’re in a factory, wheels are fine.
They have a handful of them as part of a pilot project to experiment on, to see if they’ll actually be useful. Meanwhile, they’ve actually deployed more than 200,000 Kiva-style robots - robots that work in human environments, but look absolutely nothing like a human (more like an enormous Roomba). Their newest one - the Proteus - is their first autonomous robot, but uses that same form factor. It’s an excellent example of how a robot can be specifically made to work in spaces that are designed for and occupied by humans, while itself being designed nothing whatsoever like a human, but instead to be optimal for its job.
You set the criteria that they were not used. I showed you that they were used. The criteria was not which robot was used more but if they actually used a robot that was designed as a humanoid.
Also in the previous article I showed you they have a factory and plan on producing 10,000 this year, so obviously the pilot project went well. I do not doubt that they will have many forms of robots with humanoid being one of them. When you invest in signle companies you tend to keep up on the trends more.
I will note that these robots walk like birds, not humans so I would seriously doubt they designed a Digit robot to observe humans work, and then it mirrored that behavior, as was previously suggested up thread and the reason for my comment.
Specifically:
Instead of focusing on mimicking nature, our engineering process honed in on optimizing stability and agility in movement that would allow Digit to do many different tasks. Consequently, the similarity is more of a coincidence than an intentional mimicry of mother nature.
Your welcome. I would not want to tighten the criteria. We can constrict the parameters until it is so tight that we miss the overall direction that innovation is moving. Whether they walk like a bird or a human is irrelevant. The important part is that they walk upright like a human and are able to navigate the environment like a human.
That is coming and it might not be what digit robot will do. From what I understand it will be Optimus that will learn from observing.
But lets be straight here Elon is not just high functioning. He is much higher functioning than anyone here is or had been. You can pull out 20 million people and Musk is probably higher functioning than any of them.
