But are OnStar ad Bluelink optional extras? Presumably these can be disabled or removed?
What does that have to do with it? They do use some of the features as a way to garner extra revenue, but the devices are embedded in their vehicles. Almost all of them for years now. Furthermore, they turn on those fancy features for the first year or three … included in the price of the car. A free trial of sorts, because they want to entice you to subscribe long-term.
Removal of almost all devices in cars nowadays is completely impractical. They are so intertwined that with the slightest change, all sorts of things stop working.
Well, as far as I know my Q5 isn’t connected to anything that can interfere with my driving. If ever I change it I’ll know which questions to ask. Whatever, it won’t be an EV I change to.
Audi Connect has been installed in the Q5 beginning with the 2020 model year.
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Then he should be willing to give back all the subsidy money that helped get Tesla going, right? Between loans, subsidies, and energy credits, Musk has benefited from tens of billions of dollars. Now that the subsidies are mostly in the rear view mirror, he wants to hobble everyone else trying to ramp up,
Yeah, admirable guy.
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He did.
Indeed! Brilliant! Innovative! Great manager.
The Captain
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Petrol vs electricity price is not the only measure of expensive. ICE cars need more maintenance. Petrol prices and electricity prices are volatile and could suddenly reverse after the worldwide oil glut clears.
Yup. And they don’t need a built in gateway from the OEM, like Onstar provides.
This demonstration was done nearly 10 years ago. The buzzing you hear in the brake disable demonstration is the ABS cycling at maximum rate, which results in the brakes being released more than they are on.
This ban on Chinese software has nothing to do with “national security”. It is about Ford and GM profit security.
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No one has been able to make a EV profitably even after subsidies.
Rivian, Lucid, GM, Ford, Polestar, Fiskar - None of them can make EVs profitably. They are better off buying Tesla cars and selling them.
Now with innovation in manufacturing and battery technology Elon is making the cars even more affordable.
The cars, trucks and semis are also able to drive themselves (supervised for now).
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2018 and with less than 11k miles driven this will see me out 
I’ve had a look at Audi Connect. I can’t see anything about remote braking.
The problem is most of the systems in a modern car are running off of a single, common, computer. Hack the computer and you can control everything the computer controls: throttle, brakes, HVAC, radio, windows, door locks, windshield wipers and washers, cruise control, “hands free” cell phone, navigation. This vulnerability is common to all newer cars though, not just Chinese. So my take is banning Chinese software is more a means to keep the Chinese out of the US auto market, to protect big three profits.
Steve
I’ve certainly learned something in the last couple of days.
Why would anyone want a car with a ‘kill switch’ in it?
It isn’t about what the consumer wants. The automakers build in the access points, so they can data mine the customers and charge recurring fees for “services”.
Which might happen if the oil companies were taken over by the government, but unlikely. It’s a global market, and capitalism is the business model in the US. If more money can be made by shipping petroleum products overseas, that’s where the products will go, without government intervention.
We will not buy an EV car. We travel too much to have to depend on a questionable charging infrastructure or the impact of temperatures on range. For long distance drives, we don’t stop for anything other than bathroom breaks with quick gasoline refills, so the concept of recharging while eating lunch, ASSUMING you can get you car on a charger, isn’t in the plans, since we don’t stop to eat. What we do have is electrical yard tools, from the mower, to the chainsaw, and everything in between. : In 2020, fossil fuel-powered lawn equipment emitted more than 30 million tons of carbon dioxide, the leading driver of climate change.
To put that in context, that’s as much carbon pollution as comes out of the tailpipes of 6.6 million cars over the course of a year. https://environmentamerica.org/center/articles/leaf-blowers-arent-just-noisy-theyre-also-huge-climate-polluters/
Granted, 7 million cars is a small fraction of what is out there, but replacing gas powered yard tools with electric is pretty easy to do, AND we like them much better.
We also keep environmental impact of our vehicles down by holding on to them forever. Less turnover results in less waste and lower need for new materials for a new car. Here in VA we also get taxed additionally because we own what they consider a fuel efficient vehicle, a 2013 ICE Toyota Camry. Never mind that most of our miles are put on out of state, they feel we are avoiding fuel tax by driving this car and shirking our responsibility of contributing to road maintenance. Of course this is a state that also charges personal property tax on vehicles, based on blue book, so buying a new car of any sort would increase our annual tax on vehicles significantly, with a tax rate of almost 4% of the vehicle EVERY YEAR. That’s an annual tax of about $2K on a $50K vehicle. Insurance on electric vehicles is about 20% higher than for an ICE: Are EVs and Hybrids More Expensive to Insure Versus ICE Vehicles? Mercury Insurance Expert Explains.
Frankly with the question of the points raised above, the costs of infrastructure changes, both dollar and environmental as outdated for EVs materials are scrapped for those needed for EVs, like the guardrails that now seem to need replacing as well, the environmental benefits of EVs are questionable at best and far from proven. Just wait until batteries start to need replacing, and roads require increased maintenance due to the heavier EV vehicles…there is far too much unknown about these vehicles to get evangelical about these products.
IP
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I think you bring up some good points. However, these last things are just not true and you are using them to justify your decision, IMO. EV batteries rarely have to be replaced in the car’s lifetime and recycling the materials is being done in any case (several companies are doing this, including Redwood Materials and others). Plus battery life is increasing and the subject of lots of research.
The extra weight causing more road damage is nonsensical. First off, EV cars are not much heavier than ICE cars. Look at some real numbers…please. Who has complained about all the weight of big SUVs and their road damage? Most cars weigh 3-6000 lbs (some, mostly big SUVs and pickup trucks, weigh a bit more). Big rigs weigh 80,000 lbs…and cause far far more damage to roads. Garbage trucks weigh up to 50,000 lbs and do lots of starts and stops over most every street weekly.
Mike
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Not really. The weight issue is a joke. My EV weighs about 200 pounds more than the closest gas model from the same manufacturer. Like “one adult” in the car.
Most batteries in EVs will outlast the car itself, and are recyclable if desired, or can be repurposed (at somewhat diminished capacity) for emergency household power or tied together for grid scale backup.
“Waiting for a charge” is true, and I am one who used to drive 5 hours, stop for gas, bathroom, and sandwich to each while driving, but I recently did 2000 miles from Tennessee to Boston and back (via different route) and it wasn’t a big deal. In fairness I did not have a deadline (well, a funeral, but he was gonna be dead whether I got there or not) nor kids in the car, so…
I visit a friend in Kentucky every month to 6 weeks. When I started, under a year ago, there was one place to recharge along the way. Now there are three and they are massive. When Tesla lets Hyundai’s use their system (schedule for Q4 2024 or Q1 2025, but I don’t count on it) there will be 5, even if no others are added.
All three of those are about a mile from the interstate, and Buckee’s (one of the new ones) has 15 chargers for Tesla and another 15 for others. Give it another year I expect there will be even more.
I have noticed almost no temperature impact on range. Maybe 10 miles on a full “tank”? Insignificant really.
I suspect if/when you get an EV you will like it better too, and for many of the same reasons. More powerful, fewer fumes, quieter, cleaner, less maintenance, fewer things to go wrong, etc.
PS: Filling “the tank” costs me about $25 at a public charger. About $8 in the garage. And now, mostly free since I have hooked up a minimal solar set up - so my costs, while somewhat higher upfront, will surely be less than filling with gas no matter what happens to oil prices.
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The battery issue gets brought up a lot, but I don’t think it applies in most cases. What happens is the battery degrades slowly over time, which means the car loses utility over time. So eventually in theory, you indeed would have to replace the battery because the range would become too small to be practical.
But what usually happens is that the interior wears out before the battery. For example, I have a 2013 Leaf and that battery is still at about 85%. That’s not enough for some people, but it is plenty for our applications (commuting, trips around town). I imagine I won’t need to consider a replacement for another five or ten years.
In theory, you can keep an ICE running forever, but they have the same problem with the interior. But ICEs have another problem in that once you get to high mileage the engines and transmissions start needing work. And again, there a point when it isn’t worth it. I have a Rav4 that’s similar vintage to the Leaf and I’m dealing with that right now. I’m thinking I have about two more years before it needs to go out to pasture.
So as a complete guess, I’d say a typical EV has a longer practical lifespan than a comparable ICE.
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Where did you get that?
The criminal activity of men with products for sale is way under regulated.
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The EV battery issue is one of collision damage.
DB2