From pre-diabetes to Type 2 diabetes

Investment Analysis Clubs Macro Economic Trends and Risks
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Type 2 diabetes has tremendous Macroeconomic impact due to the high cost of treating the chronic illness and its many related morbidities, such as amputation, kidney failure and blindness.
https://www.diabetes.org/about-us/statistics/cost-diabetes

The total estimated 2017 cost of diagnosed diabetes of $327 billion includes $237 billion in direct medical costs and $90 billion in reduced productivity.

A very large longitudinal study (n = 50,152) showed that seniors with pre-diabetes progress to full-blown Type 2 diabetes at a rate of about 5% per year but higher for those with severe obesity (BMI of 40 or higher), hypertension, a higher blood sugar level and/ or a family history of diabetes.

During the study period, regression to a normal blood sugar level or death happened more often than progression to diabetes. The U.S Preventive Services Task Force recognizes that there are effective ways to reverse pre-diabetes to a normal, healthy blood sugar level. They recommend that primary care doctors discuss this with their patients with pre-diabetes.

https://www.medpagetoday.com/endocrinology/diabetes/98302?xi…

The US obesity prevalence was 42.4% in 2017 – 2018. (BMI > 30)
From 1999 –2000 through 2017 –2018, US obesity prevalence increased from 30.5% to 42.4%. During the same time, the prevalence of severe obesity increased from 4.7% to 9.2%. (BMI > 40)
https://www.cdc.gov/obesity/data/adult.html

For children and adolescents aged 2-19 years in 2017-2018, the prevalence of obesity was 19.3%.
https://www.cdc.gov/obesity/data/childhood.html

I and other METARs have reversed pre-diabetes by a lower-carb diet and exercise.

The rate of Type 2 diabetes will probably rise over the next couple of decades as pre-diabetic seniors age. Also, the young obese will develop Type 2 diabetes at a younger age than the current generation, which had a lower rate of youth obesity. The companies providing monitoring devices will benefit.

https://meticulousblog.org/top-10-companies-in-diabetes-care…

Wendy

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When dealing with pre-diabetes, one can’t just rely on blood sugar levels, get your insulin level checked. Your glucose level can be normal and even your hemoglobin A1C (long term glucose average) but if your pancreas is working overtime producing insulin, not good for the long term.

JLC

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Type 2 diabetes has tremendous Macroeconomic impact due to the high cost of treating the chronic illness…

Type 2 diabetes is NOT a chronic illness, it’s curable, reversible. I’m living proof of it. All you need to do is lose weight. Stop eating the highly processed, packaged, garbage so call food that the Agroindustrial Complex sells.

Although there’s no cure for type 2 diabetes, studies show it’s possible for some people to reverse it. Through diet changes and weight loss, you may be able to reach and hold normal blood sugar levels without medication.

https://www.webmd.com/diabetes/can-you-reverse-type-2-diabet…

A body of research putting people with Type 2 diabetes on a low calorie diet has confirmed the underlying causes of the condition and established that it is reversible.

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2017/09/170913084432.h…

Background: Type 2 diabetes (T2D) has long been identified as an incurable chronic disease based on traditional means of treatment. Research now exists that suggests reversal is possible through other means that have only recently been embraced in the guidelines.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6520897/

Study reveals what causes type 2 diabetes and how to reverse it

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/327390

Please stop spreading the long held but erroneous idea that type 2 diabetes is a chronic illness. It is caused like many other illnesses by insulin resistance that occurs from eating excess sugars. The pancreas fights hard to produce insulin to combat the excess sugars but in time the high load of insulin causes insulin resistance and a whole lot of other modern illnesses. With a good diet one overcomes the overload of sugars, the excess insulin is no longer needed and the body goes back to normal

It is true that type 2 diabetes is incurable if you keep poisoning yourself with sugars.

The Captain
lost 50 pounds over a couple of years and got rid of all the chronic diseases and stopped taking the eight medications that were supposed to be for life. You have to overcome your doctor’s outdated medicine. The last time I went to see a cardiologist he wanted to keep me on statins. I showed him the latest blood test that said I did not need it. I asked him why he was prescribing it. “Just to be on the safe side” was his lame answer. I replied that in that case I would not be taking statins. He said, “OK.”

BTW, this was a very competent doctor but his training was somewhat outdated. When I told him about the diet and weight loss he talked about a doctor in California (I forget the name) who specialized in this kind of treatment and I suspect I was his first patient that had benefitted for this kind of diet. I went to see him about a second opinion about an angiogram which my now retired cardiologist recommended against except as the last resort. The new doctor’s opinion was that the angiogram was the prescribed procedure but NOT URGENT! I said to him, “If it’s not urgent I won’t do it.”

This was in Venezuela where it is next to impossible to sue for malpractice. In the US where you can sue at the drop of a hat, doctors are more likely to over test and over dose patients to CYA! Fight it!

You have to take control over your own life. BTW in 1998 (age 60) I had an angioplasty and I still have the J&J stent. This procedure was recommended by my old cardiologist who advised to use the procedure only as a last resort. I had a 90% blockage of one of my coronaries. I’m certainly in favor of doctors and medicine but used sparingly.

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I agree with captain. My Type 2 is under control with low carb diet (lots of veggies, no sugar) and metformin. Insulin or other drugs not required at present. Losing wt in process. Down 11 lbs this morning. Its all about low A1C.

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I agree with captain. My Type 2 is under control with low carb diet (lots of veggies, no sugar) and metformin. Insulin or other drugs not required at present. Losing wt in process. Down 11 lbs this morning. Its all about low A1C.

Metformin is one of the medications I no longer need! As the type 2 diabetes got worse the doctor increased the Metformin dose. Now I no longer need any.

Way to go pauleckler! Get healthy, live better and longer while spending less on healthcare!

The Captain

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Metformin is one of the medications I no longer need! As the type 2 diabetes got worse the doctor increased the Metformin dose. Now I no longer need any.

Way to go pauleckler! Get healthy, live better and longer while spending less on healthcare!

DH has been a type 1 diabetic since he was 13. We also have a low carb/keto lifestyle, resulting in his needing significantly less insulin than on a too high in carb American Diabetes Association recommended diet, though even they have FINALLY started to get more on board about reducing carbs. When I started low carbing a couple of decades ago, the magazine they put out to discuss research, Diabetes Forecast Magazine, posted a review of one of the new Atkins books that demonstrated to me they had not even read the book and were choosing to do a knee jerk rejection of the premise. I cancelled our subscription instantly.

Lowering carbs, particularly refined, has been shown to have impacts on reducing risk from cancer, Alzheimer’s, diabetes, high blood pressure, and more. Yet the Federal Gov’t continues to support sugar and grains. Modifying the food pyramid to reflect net carb consumption, rather than pushing “whole grains” endlessly or continuing to vilify good fats, would go a long way to helping the US get off the SAD died, (standard American diet.) Institutions have to follow the food pyramid if they receive federal funds.

For any of you that are curious about what sort of meals you would have eating low carb, my favorite blog is here: AlldayIdreamaboutfood.com This is the source of our favorite meal, Sheet Pan Keto Jambalaya: https://alldayidreamaboutfood.com/easy-keto-jambalaya/ We do double batches and then just microwave the leftovers for a quick meal.

This would have been the point where I would have referred you to the Low Carb Way of Life board here on TMF, but it’s slated for termination.

IP

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Type 2 diabetes has tremendous Macroeconomic impact due to the high cost of treating the chronic illness…

Type 2 diabetes is NOT a chronic illness, it’s curable, reversible. I’m living proof of it. All you need to do is lose weight. Stop eating the highly processed, packaged, garbage so call food that the Agroindustrial Complex sells.

For the bulk of Type 2 diabetics it’s a chronic disease that advances with age. I reversed it for 10 years, then medicated, then reversed for another 5, but I’ve been on medication since. I got down to 174 lbs - what I was at 16, and swam for an hour a day. Still had to take meds. I think that may be the incurable part. :slight_smile:

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DH has been a type 1 diabetic since he was 13.

Type 1 and type 2 diabetes are two different ailments

Type 1 and type 2 Diabetes: What’s the Difference?

People with type 1 diabetes don’t produce insulin. You can think of it as not having a key.

People with type 2 diabetes don’t respond to insulin as well as they should and later in the disease often don’t make enough insulin. You can think of it as having a broken key.

https://www.healthline.com/health/difference-between-type-1-…?

This is why type 2 is reversible while type 1 is chronic.

The Captain

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This is why type 2 is reversible while type 1 is chronic.

Yes Denny, I am very aware of the differences. My point was that even someone who does not manufacture their insulin and requires injections can minimize their meds requirements by reducing their carb load. You hear so much about the unaffordability of insulin, which is outrageous IMO, and how there is nothing they can do about needing insulin. While it is true that type 1 diabetics will still need insulin, they can control the amount they require by minimizing their carb intake. Going to a low carb lifestyle also controls the need for many other meds.

The nutritional guidelines the Feds push is absolutely absurd, IMO, unless their goal is to cripple the nation’s health.

IP

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…This is the source of our favorite meal, Sheet Pan Keto Jambalaya:…

quite easy to swap in cauliflower rice in this sheet pan jambalaya recipe…

Not a fan of cauliflower rice. Maybe the texture, maybe the taste. As long as it works for you.

The author of the recipe talks about cutting back on bell pepper and leaving out the onion, well, they just violated the “holy trinity” of cajun cooking (bell pepper, onion, celery). So a more proper title would be Keto Pseudo-Jambalaya.

As an aside, read an article the other day about cooking rice, letting it cool overnight (in the refrigerator), and then reheating it. That process altered the starch structure to where it wasn’t as digestible and thus not as carb spiking.

JLC

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The author of the recipe talks about cutting back on bell pepper and leaving out the onion, well, they just violated the “holy trinity” of cajun cooking (bell pepper, onion, celery). So a more proper title would be Keto Pseudo-Jambalaya.

If you need to. We use a large onion and 4 bell peppers. Modify the carb count based on your needs. We are very active and I consider leaving onions out of just about anything sacrilege.

Not a fan of cauliflower rice. Maybe the texture, maybe the taste. As long as it works for you.

Needs plenty of seasoning and a good amount of olive oil. I also prefer to sautee it than microwave it. Nukes up well. I typically have a container in the fridge of Cauli-rice Pilaf with onions, red pepper, edamame, zucchini and yellow squash, spinach and either cajun or curry seasoning. That along with sausage, salmon, rotisserie chicken pieces or even a hamburger makes for a super quick meal.

As an aside, read an article the other day about cooking rice, letting it cool overnight (in the refrigerator), and then reheating it. That process altered the starch structure to where it wasn’t as digestible and thus not as carb spiking.

Short grain brown rice with butter and furikake seasoning used to be my absolute favorite. Still is, but can’t eat it. In my usual way of cooking I would make a large pot of it and nuke a portion when ready to eat. Spiked my blood sugar in a big way, even with the fat from the butter which should slow the carb absorption. We don’t all process things the same way. Was vegan for a very tortured two years until I found low carb heaven. My body responds well to this way of eating. If I eat too many carbs at once now, I get heart palpitations and nausea. Doesn’t take much.

IP,
still having many vegan meals, but rarely have grains

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Yes Denny, I am very aware of the differences.

IP, I meant the comment for general consumption. Surely someone who is dealing with type 1 diabetes knows it.

The Captain

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The Captain
lost 50 pounds over a couple of years and got rid of all the chronic diseases and stopped taking the eight medications that were supposed to be for life. You have to overcome your doctor’s outdated medicine. The last time I went to see a cardiologist he wanted to keep me on statins. I showed him the latest blood test that said I did not need it. I asked him why he was prescribing it. “Just to be on the safe side” was his lame answer. I replied that in that case I would not be taking statins. He said, “OK.”


Congrats on losing the weight etc...

I have done the same 50 lbs off as well. I can come off of metformin and a statin. I am off the BP med. But I kept some of the metformin and the statin. Notice you are still peeing all the time? Yep once a diabetic always a diabetic. I am very pleased with where I am now, but my chest arteries have some plaque and calcium build up. The statin and metformin during this period with my new lower weight can afford me to clean up my arteries.

Captain you are blowing your chance at cleaning up your arteries. That is what the doctor wanted to do with you.
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Your glucose level can be normal and even your hemoglobin A1C (long term glucose average)

Yeah. HbA1C is treated by many doctors as if it was a definite indicator for prediabetes/early diabetes, even though it’s dubious whether it’s even as good an indicator as fasting serum glucose (assuming the test is handled properly).

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Yeah. HbA1C is treated by many doctors as if it was a definite indicator for prediabetes/early diabetes, even though it’s dubious whether it’s even as good an indicator as fasting serum glucose (assuming the test is handled properly).

My internist participates in a local annual health video conference. His usual topic is health and diet. He mentioned various labs to test for diabetes/prediabetes and then mentioned he started prescribing continuous glucose monitoring devices. You get real time results and see how you react do different activities and different meals.

I’ve seen a few athletes wearing them during various fitness events from long endurance runs to high intensity fitness/weightlifting competitions to help with in competition fueling and recovery.

JLC

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I’ve seen a few athletes wearing them…

I’ve noticed that there’s been quite a heavy promotion of these devices to non-diabetics…for biohacking and sports mainly …for about 5 or 6 years or so now along with a few high profile athletes promoting them. Part of me thinks it’s technology looking for value in the absence of evidence. The Quantified Self part of me thinks you won’t find evidence until you start looking. I’ve been a bit more interested in whether/when the technology will become part of a regular “wearable”.

Not so much for the actual glucose reading itself but rather if the readings could act as a surrogate marker for circulating insulin levels/insulin resistance. I’ve been wondering “what if…” with regard to my own metabolic health for
a while now, largely as a result of subscribing to a couple of longevity websites that bang on about this. Rather than wait for a development that may never come, I asked my primary care physician if she could see fit to add a circulating insulin test to the Usual Suspects at my most recent physical so I could stop wondering…or act now, if necessary. I don’t know why this isn’t done more frequently with the first hint of departure from healthy homeostasis. I’m assuming that insurance companies don’t reimburse for it in the absence of rising A1c or fasting glucose etc… which is kind of a bit late in the game… and that physicians are a bit inhibited to suggest a test that would be an out of pocket expense.

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VeeAnn,

You can use the blood glucose/ketones level
obtained with a finger prick test as a proxy for circulating insulin levels.

A level below 100 is getting into ketosis and below 70 will be weight loss.

Typically to hit these levels a person eating SAD will need a water fast for 48 hours.

However, a low carb diet, not a keto diet but one low on processed foods and grains, will provide this type of ration in as little as a 12 hour fast. In other words, eat real food, any food with less than five ingredients on the label. No sweeteners of any sort, and eat dinner then no snacks and then eat breakfast 12 hours after the last bite of food was eaten.

It really is simple, but for me at least, very difficult.

Cheers
Qazulight

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Quazulight…I think you misunderstood my rationale for looking at my circulating insulin. Thanks to a diet somewhat similar to your description…but not low carb enough for nutritional ketosis…for close to half a century (more if you count my years living at home on my mum’s watch) I really didn’t have any need for wondering based on all the regular parameters. It was more of an overexhuberant desire to be proactive and nip any tendency in the bud.

Also wondering in a theoretical sense if use of, say, continuous read glucose monitors or other real time sensing devices are likely to have an impact on preventing even pre-diabetes in the demographic that’s on the way there but not quite yet.

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Type 2 diabetes is reversible, but not curable. That is a belief system, but not the science experience. Gain back the 50 pounds and you will find it’s still there. That’s what the Docs and science told me, and it’s what happened when I gained the weight back. :slight_smile: I researched my Statin and kept it. I stopped Lisinopril, but went back on after a conversation with my Endocrinologist, rethinking through the family medical history, and some research. I wish I could lose 50 pounds and drop all the meds. Good job!

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I like just about none of the diet advice here. The reason most people are very unsuccessful dieting with any of the low carb advice. It is also misnomers about the food building blocks involved in recommending a low carb diet.

I did Noom. The success rate is ultra high, almost ten percent succeed in something close to what I did. But not nearly as much. I lost 50 pounds for over a year now.

The problem with other diets is the dieters learn to eat more calories pretty quickly.

Noom focuses on people monitoring their calories and modifying the qualities of the food they eat.

Some of the suggestions here that all you need to do…yeah it worked for several of us that we have lost major amounts of weight but we are a very small minority of people to have done it at all.

The biggest behavioral change I need when losing weight is simply an early bedtime.