Converting electricity into green hydrogen to use it to make about 30% of the original electricity does not seem to make much sense. I’m not sure about the 30% number but there is loss at every step
Electrolysis, extract hydrogen from water - 70–80%
Liquify hydrogen - about 60% of the total cost of liquid hydrogen storage - ???%
Transport hydrogen - ???%
Fuel cell efficiency - 40 to 80%
Might as well eliminate the middleman.
Annual Lecture 2024 - Michael Liebreich. Global Energy Transition Trends and Hydrogen
There is a concept called EROI, energy return on investment.
“Energy return on investment (EROI) is a ratio that measures the amount of usable energy delivered from an energy source versus the amount of energy used to get that energy resource.”
With an EROI less than one (less than 0.25!) hydrogen is not what one might call a thermodynamic darling.
Hydrogen will have a few small uses where it will be very useful, but because thermodynamics and no free lunch, most of the green babble strikes me as hopelessly hopeless mixed with cynically cynical.
What mix of modernist magical non-thinking, bizarre financial structuring, and keep hydrocarbon pipes and stuff in place while whistling doodah is driving all this? Hell if I know.
Keep in mind that virtually all hydrogen demand is currently for industrial refining of petroleum, making fertilizer, and the synthesis of a variety of chemicals. It is not for fuel or balloons.
Actual hydrogen atoms are needed to synthesize a bunch of stuff.
We very much need a clean and efficient way to produce green hydrogen.
As of 2020, 5,648 hydrogen fuel cell buses are in use around the world, with 93.7% of them in China. Some early adopters of fuel cell buses have opted to focus on battery electric buses, with London having 950 battery electric buses, and 20 hydrogen fuel cell buses in their fleet as of 2023.[41]
Something of an assumption there. iirc, Nigeria is notorious for the bulk of the oil income being hoovered up by the (L&Ses), rather than benefiting the people.
From Forbes, March 28, 2024… The Japanese Ministry of Economy, Trade and Industry announced it plans to invest 4 trillion yen ($26.46 billion) in a public-private partnership to develop a next-generation hydrogen-powered passenger jet.
As reported by AFP, the ministry said in a statement, “It is important for us to build next-generation aircraft based on technologies where Japan is competitive while also contributing to the decarbonization of air transport.”
Japan expects the new sustainable aircraft development to be completed after 2035.
Boeing is expecting entry into the Hydrogen Air Plane market.
Of course, Boeing is run by executives who claim super intelligence and then let the world down. Why not the pay is great. Completely lazy baggage who passed a few tests at the college level. Showing up must be such hard work.
And WSJ had letters to the editor last week pointing out that California regs defy the laws of physics. Kind of like the Indiana legislature decreeing that in Indiana the value of pi will be 3.00.
Hydrogen is likely to be better than battery electrics in locomotives and heavy trucks. And battery aircraft are probably not practical.
Earlier forecasts on the adaptation of energy technologies put hydrogen before battery powered vehicles of all stripes.
Putting up charging stations and home charging are easier and less costly than building out a hydrogen economy. That said I think hydrogen will begin to replace everything.
The US needs to get on with it. Inflation in the US is conquered. We need to continue to put resources to work on our industrial buildout.
Yes, much of the eastern railroads had overhead electric systems. Especially Pennsylvania RR. Northeast Corridor line is electric. I think west to Harrisburg. But large investment required to electrify the west.
Third rail electric is used by some subways but considered dangerous most places. Overhead wires are bad enough when people climb on top of cars.
To understand the potential impact of switching from traditional jet fuel to hydrogen fuel in aviation, Anna Cybulsky, Mallapragada and colleagues modeled its use in the electrification of regional and short-range turboprop aircraft.
The researchers calculated that the extra bulk of a hydrogen fuel tank and fuel cells retrofitted to an existing plane would need to be offset by weight reductions elsewhere, such as reducing the aircraft’s payload (cargo or passengers)…
A bigger challenge than switching aviation fuel types may be providing the infrastructure needed to generate and distribute hydrogen in a low-carbon and cost-effective manner…Cybulsky and colleagues noted that because grid electricity prices can be highly variable across a region, it may be more cost-effective to transport hydrogen from a low-cost production facility to end-users. For these reasons, the researchers suggest that the rollout of hydrogen-based aviation might start at locations that have favorable conditions for hydrogen production, such as Hamburg, Germany, or Barcelona, Spain.
