METARs & 2nd Covid boosters

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So many METARs are over age 60 that I’d like to ask what you’all think about when to get your second Covid booster. Jeff and Steve have already done this but I’m not sure whether to get it now or wait until, say, October when I get my flu shot.

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/04/17/us/second-covid-booster-6…

**Americans Over 60 Should Get Second Booster, Official Says**

**Citing data from Israel, Dr. Ashish K. Jha, the new White House Covid-19 response coordinator, said a second booster offered significant protection to older people.**

But maybe it would be better to wait.

https://www.reuters.com/business/healthcare-pharmaceuticals/…

**Moderna says dual variant booster with Beta more effective vs Omicron than current shot**
**By Michael Erman, Reuters, 4/19/2022**

**April 19 (Reuters) - Moderna Inc (MRNA.O) on Tuesday said a COVID-19 booster designed to target the Beta variant as well as the original coronavirus generated a better immune response against a number of virus variants including Omicron.**

**Dr. Jacqueline Miller, a top Moderna scientist, said the company had no immediate plans to file for authorization of the bivalent vaccine including the Beta variant. It will submit the data to the U.S. Food and Drug Administration in order to lay the groundwork for a future bivalent vaccine candidate that includes the Omicron variant as a target....The bivalent vaccine induced higher antibody responses against variants that were not specifically included in the vaccine....** [end quote]

Moderna is hoping to have a bivalent vaccine ready for the fall, in anticipation of a winter Covid surge. That sounds like a winner.

I got a fever and flu-like symptoms from my last Moderna booster so I’m not too eager to get one now if I’m just going to get another one in October. (Also, I got pretty sick from my Shingrix shot a couple of weeks ago and anticipate the same from the second one in a couple of months.)

I’m beginning to feel like a pin cushion.

What are you’all planning?
Wendy

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What are you’all planning?

I received my first booster in January. I have awhile to think about it. By June/July, there may be more data/information for me to consider.

PSU

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What are you’all planning?

Because it fades relatively quickly I am in no hurry. I’m waiting for things to get serious where I live…

DB2

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I got the second booster Pfizer.

I have no problem with it.

The tide is rising now. In the fall I am get a third booster.

One problem is the duration of boosters for seniors. As the tide rises now the coverage of a booster may only be four to eight weeks for the seniors. But it may be critical.

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I got my 4th dose of Pfizer back in February. Just a slight “tired & achy” feeling for 12-24 hours afterwards, but nothing that prevented me from going about my normal activities.

I got my first “high dose” flu shot for those 65 and over last October. That’s as sick as I’ve been from any inoculation. Felt like crap for about 2 days afterwards.

intercst

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Shingrix shot a couple of weeks ago and anticipate the same from the second one in a couple of months

First Shingrix shot: Just a sore muscle for a day or so.

Second Shingrix shot:

First day, started to feel like I was getting a cold.
Second day: Felt like I had a cold/mild fever, so took Nyquil and didn’t go anywhere/do anything.
Third day: Cold/fever gone overnight and felt fine.

One of my doctors said he had virtually the identical reaction.

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I got my 2nd booster (Moderna) a couple of weeks ago. I look forward to getting a third booster at some other point in the future. And if someone says a fourth is useful I’ll be in line for that as well.

JimA

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Jeff and Steve have already done this but I’m not sure whether to get it now or wait until, say, October when I get my flu shot.

As Ben said to Little Joe as Hos headed for the dinner table “he who hesitates is lost”.

Had my second booster a week ago. Michigan seems to be embarking on a spring wave, just like last year.

The state is now only releasing covid data on Wednesdays.

Michigan reports 10,474 new COVID cases, 78 deaths over past week

The 7-day average for positive tests is up to 7.8% from 5.4% last week.

https://www.clickondetroit.com/health/2022/04/20/michigan-re…

That weekly new case figure works out to over 1400/day. That is double the new case rate a month ago. Total in hospital bottomed out at 453 on 4/6 and has risen to 517 as of today.

Things on the Steve agenda:

-trip to Henry Ford Museum tomorrow to check out Apollo 11 exhibit.

-first trip of the season to Greenfield Village Saturday (temp forecast to be over 70)

-trip to museum near Kalamazoo on Sunday for a historical lecture.

-trip to car show on May 7

First things I have done for fun since last October.

Steve

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I’m over 60, 2 Moderna vaxes, 1 Moderna booster (Dec2021).

I’m planning to wait until either the Fall and the bivalent booster, OR until the next definite surge begins.

I’ll be traveling in September, so I might just get the booster prior to that.

So, there are some “if-then” conditions.

I’m content with NOT getting the 2nd booster ASAP.
Here’s why.
I have at least some immunity. Some folks are seeming to suggest that immunity “wanes”… OK, I agree that SOME of the antibodies do wane.

Immunity is NOT an on-off switch.

There are a bunch of types of antibodies. Some are rapidly produced at the first sign of infection, and wane rapidly.
Others take longer to produce, but also last a lot longer.

AND, there are the active T cells and B cells, as well as Memory T and B cells. These are already primed for Covid-19.
These WBCs already have sensory proteins (similar to antibodues) attached to the cell membrane, that detect Covid-19.

Let me step back a moment.
The FIRST exposure, the body has NO “sensors” to detect the pathogen, and NO immune response infrastructure to that pathogen. Therefore, by the time the body recognizes the pathogen, 3 or 4 days have passed.
Then, it takes another week or 10 days for the body’s defenses (the immune response) to grow to the point of protecting the body.

That’s why the experts recommend 2 weeks after a vax, to reach full protection - ie immunity.

It’s also why people get sick 4 days after exposure, sick for a week, then get well over 3 or 4 days.
(My explanation is, of course, a bit generalized.)

I’ve already got “sensors”: some antibodies, T cells, B cells, AND inactive but primed T cells and B cells.
My body does NOT need that initial 4 days.
Nor does it need the next week of building the immune response infrastructure.

My body will respond almost immediately, RAPIDLY producing new antibodies, T cells, and B cells to the next infection.

Within 2 days to 4 days after exposure, I expect I will have a full immune response. This response will be so rapid that 1) I won’t even know I’ve been infected, or 2) I will be mildly ill, or 3) I will experience a mild flu.

I do not expect to have a severe illness.
I do NOT expect to be hospitalized.
I’m willing to take the chance, and not get the 2nd booster until it becomes obvious that it’s needed.

And that’s just the Aquired/Adaptive Immune response.
Nobody talks about how innate immunity and the Complement System support immune responses.

I’ll reassess in September.
And again later in the Fall.

:thinking:
ralph

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Complement_system#:~:text=Th….

The complement system, also known as complement cascade, is a part of the immune system that enhances (complements) the ability of antibodies and phagocytic cells to clear microbes and damaged cells from an organism, promote inflammation, and attack the pathogen’s cell membrane. It is part of the innate immune system,[1] which is not adaptable and does not change during an individual’s lifetime. The complement system can, however, be recruited and brought into action by antibodies generated by the adaptive immune system.

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I had 2 boosters, last one in March.

Hope to get another in Sep / Oct, maybe a variant specific …

Being boosted ups my self confidence which I enjoy.

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rainphakir added to your Favorite Fools list.

Wendy

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I’m 82, got Pfizer 2nd booster yesterday. Slight tenderness at injection site if I press on it. Same for first booster. Original 2 vaccinations had no tenderness that I remember. I will get another if offered in the fall. I want all the protection I can get as I see the masks coming off and people think it is over. I hope it is, but see no need to chance it.

jg4

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I’m in my late 40s, and I’m not eligible yet.

When I become eligible for my second booster, I will seek out the J&J vaccine to complete the trifecta. My initial two doses (a year ago) were Pfizer. I picked Moderna for my first booster (just before Thanksgiving) because studies showed that it had somewhat higher efficacy than Pfizer. I also figured that each vaccine has some hidden benefit that the others don’t have.

I wonder how much better the J&J vaccine would have been if it had been a 2-dose regimen like Moderna and Pfizer.

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I had 2 boosters, last one in March.

Ditto. I’m in the MrPlunger camp. I anticipate another booster in the fall. Also, since it was both very free and very easy to get, why not? (you can only be ‘chipped’ so many times, right?)

Pete

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I was getting my passport photo at Walgreens Tuesday and had to wait about 15 minutes for them to “fix” it to the right size. I wandered to the back where the pharmacy is, saw their Covid sign and decided to just do it. It has been 6 months since my last booster. I’ve had 3 Moderna and now 1 Pfizer, which was all they had at Walgreens. I never had any problems with the Moderna shots and have heard lately that mix and matching may be a good idea. I have no reaction to my Pfizer shot, just barely a very little pain at the injection site.

Six months from right now is October, so I think because they are recommending people over 60 get the next booster, that is what people should do. I’m over the 70 mark!

–Linda

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We got ours this week. DW had no symptoms; I was “blah” the next day.

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I’m 55, good health, no co-morbidities, and I had my 3rd Moderna shot in mid-November. I’m eligible for another booster, but I’m holding off for now because Covid rates are low in my area (NC), and I’m at very low risk of serious illness or complications if I were to get it at this point due to the immunity built up by 3 prior shots. (Great post by rainphakir upthread on the durable immune response the body maintains even if neutralizing antibodies are no longer present.)

My game plan is to hold off until at least mid-May when I’ll be 6 months out from my last booster. From there I will keep an eye on local Covid rates and if we appear to be entering another serious wave I’ll go ahead and pull the trigger on a third shot, just cause it’s free, risk is very very low of serious side effects, and I don’t want to get sick: I know severe illness is very unlikely, but I’ve had multiple acquaintances my age who’ve been vaccinated and still gotten quite sick with Covid with flu-like symptoms for a week and a persistent cough and fatigue afterward for weeks more.

If the current rise of cases in NC over the last few weeks swells higher and I get a shot in a few weeks or a month, I’ll look forward to getting the bivalent Omicron vaccine next fall/early winter after another 6 months have passed.

If I were over 65 and had co-morbidities, then I wouldn’t wait any longer than 6 months to get another booster, unless Covid rates were extremely low in my area, in which case I’d wait until the next wave was building.

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I’m beginning to feel like a pin cushion.

No kidding!!! Me too. I’ve had more shots in 2021 than perhaps when I was 2, 6, or 12 years old. There were all the covid shots, then the shingles shots, and the flu shot.

For my next covid shot, I’m waiting for a reformulation to better cover more recent variants.