NFT’s are not in the toilet!

After reading several articles about NFTs lately I have come to the conclusion that they are not really in the toilet, as some have said.

They’re much further down the sewage system than that.I don’t know where the worst part of the worst part is, but that’s pretty much where they are, I think.

The scandal is that one story says down 98%, the other says down 97%. Oh, who to believe?



You are hugging the bowl in that ultimate search for likes. Good luck with that.

I am holding off for six months to two years before selling mine. The market will be back. The volatility is off the charts obviously.

If the EU rules on cryptos soon Eth will start to rise.

I do not know if there are other newsworthy obstacles.

My partnership is waiting for the next 1 to 2 years before acting. Our CEO is selling his marketing business. He was to sell end of this year. But at the beginning of this year gave himself three years or before as a target for selling his current business.

I took his lead two months ago and went into marketing my prints and merchandise for Christmas. Should be an excellent year for me.

Equities wont be seriously back until we get into 2024. Hold on if you are long…but there is more pain ahead.

Well, despite reading that wonderful NFT thread that you and albaby had a while back, I’m not comfortable with NFTs because I really don’t understand them. Which, by the way, restricts a whole bunch of investment classes I invest in (credit default swaps, junk bonds, tulips, etc.) because I don’t understand them, but I sleep pretty well.

From the article you linked to:

This marks the membership token with a “verified buyer” flag, after which buyers can connect to an NFT marketplace and purchase a Home onChain NFT with a single click, resulting in sale and settlement.

“The sale of the NFT results in a change in the ownership of the LLC, and thus the underlying property,” a company spokesperson said.

IIRC, albaby’s point was that most NFTs didn’t really transfer anything other than a location to a work of art (and I use the term ‘work of art’ rather loosely here. With, of course, the exception of my Wacky Wolf NFTs which I’m trying to sell for $3.2 billion. No takers so far.)

This transaction is transferring ownership of a physical item (an LLC which owns a house). I assume the LLC doesn’t own any other assets or liabilities. That would be a bummer if the LLC had a mortgage payable for $175,000.

In other words, this particular NFT is a vehicle to transfer USD in exchange for a building. Which is the same thing my checks do. Or what my credit card does when I purchase my monthly rooibos fix from Amazon with ‘one click’.

Apologies in advance if I misstated anything albaby said and I already stated I don’t understand NFTs that well, so the whole NFT thing doesn’t make much sense to me.

Just saying.




You are always the gentleman, no apologies needed.

I have thought about what an NFT is with several people, MIT class online, etc…etc…

This is very simple.

The Mona Lisa is everywhere. Photo copies, TV shows, movies…magazines…newspapers…

Keep that in mind.

I have a dollar bill printed on cotton. The art on it denotes it is worth one dollar. The cotton bill is what I have. The art gives it value. That same cotton bill with the art of a twenty dollar bill is now worth $20.

So what gives with art? The canvas and oil donates different or non fungible values given by what was actually painted.

You can get all the copies of the Mona Lisa you want, infinite, but you can not get the actual canvas.

With blockchain you buy a single token, a one off, it does not matter how many infinite copies there are.

That of course does not speak to trading houses. There are plenty of business startups that will fail. Like in the equities markets, see the dotcom craze…and many before it.

But does that mean the blockchain or the NFT token fails? No.

Other things like music or manuscriptions can also denote a token.

Digital files are great to denote the value of the token. This includes a digital file of a contract, but the lawyers have to hash that out. I wont vouch for it.

Investment grade art has a CAGR of 25%. What is investment grade art? That is beyond the scope of this conversation. But it wont be in the digital world what you want. I get that. The millennials have very different tastes.

All that is for sale is the token. It is a one off. It only has value if the next guy can be found to make the market liquid. Which is why I am waiting for the market within the next two years to rally.

1 Like

I’m not an attorney or real estate expert, but I have heard of buying an LLC that holds real estate, usually for local tax reasons. However, when you buy an LLC you also buy the liabilities along with the assets. For that reason, it is important to vet the LLC prior to buying it. That can’t be done on the blockchain. Part of vetting the LLC as part of any property transaction would be making sure the LLC holds clear title to the property. That also can’t be done on the blockchain.

Basically, I don’t see the advantage of putting the transaction on the blockchain. @albaby1 ?


None whatsoever. From the description in the article, the transaction wasn’t on the blockchain. It seems as though all of the relevant instruments that actually conveyed the interest in the company which owned the real estate were drafted in the typical way.

The only thing that is at all different is that instead of seller signing the closing documents in an office using a pen on paper and the buyer using a wire transfer to move the sale proceeds, they closed the transaction by using an NFT. Which - whatever? Instead of buyer authorizing a wire transfer and seller sending an e-signature, buyer moved the money through an NFT platform and seller sent an NFT instead of an e-sig?

Seems pointless to layer on the NFT thing, except for the publicity.



I do not know the financing of the deal but financing on the blockchain for large amounts of money might be far less expensive. The gas for $100 v $175,000 might be the same or close to it to deliver the dollar value.

Al, you were typing a moment ago.

To explain this a bit further, a non profit fundraiser gets a call from a donor. The amount to be donated is $50k but by BTC. If the transfer was by Mastercard the cost would be far higher. The gas for the transaction does not scale up by the amount of the transaction.

1 Like

I can see why you would want to put it on the Blockchain by making an NFT out of your property. How do you like having to go through a title search and pay for it every time you buy a piece of property?

** Irrefutable History Of Ownership

Each blockchain ledger provides a history of every step and transaction for every asset. That’s a lot of information. For example, if you buy an apartment with NFT asset properties, you can check every previous buyer, investment, action, legal dispute, payment and more. It should be part of its entire transactional history and logged within the NFT.


1 Like

My credit union charges $20 for a domestic wire transfer.

To explain this a bit further, a non profit fundraiser gets a call from a donor. The amount to be donated is $50k but by BTC. If the transfer was by Mastercard the cost would be far higher. The gas for the transaction does not scale up by the amount of the transaction.

Or you could transfer by ACH which would cost about $0.75.

1 Like

So blockchain sounds like a highly programmable digitization of information, more like three-dimensional rather than linear, say like a pdf-signed contract, plus, the deed, plus I forget what else goes with a house, but I can see the use of NFT’s for that, as another digitized format, but i don’t see that one can become an NFT artist and expect to see large sums anymore than those people who thought the internet would make anyone with an idea an internet millionaire in 1999. People with real successful companies couldn’t make the transition onto making internet millions back then. Why would people suddenly imagine they can become in-demand NFT artists if they are not already in-demand artists today in the real world?

Aren’t the real-world people cashing in on NFT’s just trying to climb on the grift raft, same as crypto, using their name recognition as a sales tool?

“NFT’s” and blockchain are two different things, correct? Blockchain is the medium, right? So selling a real house and using blockchain to keep records and exchange funds is very different than imagining a total no-name person with no connection to real world art and no cred, trying to make a killing selling their no-name NFT? Maybe I’m missing something.


I am not an expert, but I do want to understand the technology. I am still fumbling around and trying to piece this all together.

When it comes to the art piece some makes sense and other parts of it don’t. Like the Ape craze. I think that was people throwing money down the drain. But I could see a NFT of any piece of real Art and it doesn’t even have to be famous. Just like the house article the piece of art would be put on the blockchain and track every owner and who it was sold to. This would cut down on the fraud in the art world. Not saying it would stop it completely because I imagine someone will come up with a way to cheat, but this will make it a lot harder.


If all that information was already on the blockchain that could work, but right now none of it is. Even if starting today all that information was on the blockchain, you’d still have to review all the legacy sources just as you do today.



Western Union now sends you to “Convera” their company for larger amounts and charges a percentage. As I am saying gas is not a percentage.

Is there a dollar limit on ACH?

ACH transfers are subject to limits on how much money can be moved. These limits can be per day, per single transaction or per single month and range from $10,000 per month to as high as $25,000 a month depending on the bank.

I am somewhat successful already but that is besides the point.

A well trained artist can design for a new market. I am not a one trick pony.

I am not trying to sell my NFTs right now because the market is down/flat.

Bored Apes then later others exploited something. The platforms, particularly Opensea which is 60% of the market, began to offer properties in this case meaning characteristics. The properties were percentage based and declared as AI which is a bit much in my estimation. There is the properties AI of the Yuga labs that made the apes and the platform AI that match up the properties for display to the buyers as percentages. The Bored Apes are 10k “cards” or individual pieces. But all the things that make up an ape such as the fur, eyes, hair, mouth, etc etc are interchangeable parts that are rearranged. So if I an ape has a mohawk like 68 other apes then that property has a rarity of .69%. Some cards have common properties and less value. Some cards have rarer properties and more value. The game theory trick is that if the rarer cards go up in value the entire 10k cards edge up in value as well.

That is why the apes are so valuable. There are other factors that make up the art such as the monkey head being the first thing in some art packages that people play with in design. Or the cartoons being part of the culture for younger guys. Or the tech having limits but getting into AI to mix and match the parts or property outcomes was a way to make 10k cards.

1 Like

No Sykes they are putting all the legacy sources on blockchain also. That is the whole point of it. Everything about the property, every lawsuit, every sale, every bankruptcy, all of it. It will be sitting on the blockchain and when you go to buy the property you will be able to review it yourself. I can see this making a sale much more faster and easier.



Doesn’t that sound like beanie babies or pet rocks? I still don’t get it, I am really not interested in anything to do with the bored Apes but that is just me.


1 Like

An individual bored ape card is minor. It is decorated a certain way. But the concept is ground breaking. I think the crypto punks did the same thing, but I am not sure the platforms had the AI properties to make use of in that earlier card edition.

It is just game theory. It worked.

If I have a problem with an Amazon vendor (for example, won’t accept responsibility for an issue with a product), I can go directly to Amazon for help.

If I have a problem with my bank account (for example, an erroneous withdrawal), I can go directly to my banker for help.

If I have a problem with my charge card (for example, getting charged for something I didn’t buy), I can go directly to VISA for help.

If I have a problem with my retirement account (for example, an erroneous withdrawal), I can go directly to Fidelity for help.

If I have a problem with crypto currency or an NFT transaction (for example, stolen crypto currency), who do I go to for help?