NATO members Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, and Poland will seek European Union funding to build a network of bunkers, barriers, distribution lines, and military warehouses along their borders with Russia and Belarus, Estonian officials said on September 28. The three Baltic countries initially announced the plan for a “Baltic defense line” in January. In May, Poland announced a similar project called the “Eastern Shield” designed to strengthen its borders with the Russian exclave of Kaliningrad and with Belarus. “The need for a defense line stems from the security situation and supports NATO’s new forward defense concept,” Estonian Defense Minister Hanno Pevkur said.
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Is it going to work any better than the Atlantic Wall or the Maginot Line? Will it stops drones from reaching their targets? Generals always fighting the last war. Russia’s leadership (oligarchs and apparatchiks) needs to be neutered. Let Ukraine do it!
Russia has gone from empire to second rate banana republic. Unfortunately, dismantling the USSR didn’t work as well as it could have because the oligarchs kidnapped the economy. Without a vibrant economy it’s hard to impossible to have a democracy. I remember Russian civilians hankering back to good old communism.
Worth reading:
Why do older citizens of Russia when asked often say things were better under the Soviet Union and communism?
Was watching a bald and bankrupt video or five last night and I kept hearing the older men and women always say that things were better before the fall of communism…is this a case of just weird nostalgia or is it rooted in something deeper? My gut feeling is that he’s talking to people who more or less were left behind when capitalism came to town but I cannot tell for sure. Someone who’s way more versed than me would know. Were times better under communism, or just the perception?
The Captain
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The Maginot Line worked in that it forced the Germans to go around it. The French had originally planned to extend the fortifications but ran out of money (and Belgium complained that they were going to be left on the wrong side of the line).
DB2
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Yes. That’s because the main purpose isn’t to stop Russia in an eventual war (it won’t work well for that). The main purpose is to bring money (from Germany and France) and provide new jobs in the country to improve their economy.
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Portugal is working hard to maintain, improve, and extend its infrastructure. Earlier this year they finished a three station extension to the metro line connecting Porto to Vila Nova de Gaia. They are close to finishing a new metro line in Porto and this year they started on a new line from Porto to Vila Nova de Gaia which include a new bridge across the Douro river. I saw a gorgeous mock-up model of the bridge made out of thin slabs of wood, a work of art! They bought dozens of new busses, German and Chinese. They are building a new bus route that works more like the metro that will experiment with hydrogen fuel. Also planned is a new light rail line. In addition, private construction is practically growing residential apartment blocks. I have no idea where there will find sufficient buyers to fill them.
The point is that construction and infrastructure maintenance used huge numbers of workers and that keeps the economy firing on all cylinders. When China built a port in some African or Asian nation that could not pay for it, they took control of the port. If Portugal can’t pay for all this infrastructure work, I don’t see how the lenders can repossess the metro and other transit infrastructure. Brilliant!
The Captain
Rubi
Rosa
Amarela
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The Germans also built the Siegfried Line. It slowed the Allies down, but didn’t save the “brownshirt brigade”. “Vertical envelopment” was not greatly advanced at that time. Helos had barely been invented, and drones did not exist at anything remotely resembling their capability now.
Only option for delivering anything heavier than a man with a rifle was gliders, and they were limited in capability and survivability.
Steve
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I think “wall” is the wrong term. Tanks are easy to stop these days. Other methods work fine and are more versatile. Much less steel and concrete required.
But a plan with facilities in place to respond to attack is a good idea.
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Captain I have to say that sounds like a socialist. Where is the part that they shouldn’t be building it if they can’t pay for it?
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Nato should be willing to support investment for defense on its exposed fronts. Makes good common sense to me. Defense is not in the “socialist” category in my view.
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How is a Metro line part of Defense?
The US would pay for it, as long as the money was used to buy from the USian “military industrial complex”.
Steve
If NATO gets into a war Russia begins with them we do not want any Russians dead.
We need to defund NATO.
There should not be a genocide of the Russians.
Look at Ukraine. That is a genocide of the Russians. Is it 41k dead? Something like that. Meaning millions of Russians have died in reality. The doctors with borders are reporting almost no Russians are alive. This must end.
Horrible.
We should pull down all our alliances. After all we have bigotries we need to itch. We need bigots to keep the Russians alive
That logic is for the birds!
Where did you get the idea that a metro line is part of the defense of the Eastern borders with Russia and Belarus? It is fake news.
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Interesting how threads can be derailed,
Is a metro line socialist, communist, capitalist, fascist, randian, clannish, foreign, or sovereign?
If you define what you mean by “socialist” in this instance I might understand your question.
The Captain
You are advocating that someone else paying for a Metro line, instead of the people using it, is brilliant.
This is exactly what I have been saying. It’s amazing how people’s principles change when they get something on other people’s dime. We all do it but it sheds a light on how people and incentives change people’s most ardent beliefs.
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Socialism is the bogeyman in VZ.
Socialism is your friend in Europe.
This one hasn’t hit the internet yet. What is “VZ”?
Venezuela would be my guess.
JimA
I’m reporting.
The Captain