Tesla recycles Li ion batteries
https://electrek.co/2022/05/09/tesla-increase-battery-recycl…
Tesla also has an 8 year warranty on their batteries. In practice almost all
last at least as long as the car. Tesla has a sophisticated cooling system for the batteries , not all makers do. Pampered batteries have a long life span
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I am rather heavily invested in the commodities used to make electric cars this includes but not limited to copper OZL, lithium PLS, nickel IGO, rare earths LYC, all ASX tickers.
So understand it will not be possible for everyone who has an ICE car now to have an EV, there are just not enough mines. This is not a well understood point.
- In most countries the electric grid is insufficient to charge EV’s if everyone had one.
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Funny that you invest in commodities used to make electric cars, and then disparage EVs.
IMO, more mines will be developed and new materials will be used in EVs.
WRT to grid, no country exists where everyone has an EV. Therefore, it is not a grid problem currently. The grid is constantly being upgraded with new generation to match new demand. So your claim about the grid is bogus.
Jaak
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Funny that you invest in commodities used to make electric cars, and then disparage EVs.
Why is it funny? The reason I disparage them is as a result of looking at all the resources and process used to make them. And the more you look the less there is to like. That is not going to stop me trying to make money out of it. I don’t like cancer but I still invest in pathology labs.
IMO, more mines will be developed and new materials will be used in EVs.
A copper mine alone can take up to 10 years from discovery to production, no copper no electric motors and at the moment there is not enough copper mines in the world.
Here is a link to a news doco that covers some of these issue, what I am saying is not a secret it is well known in the market
https://www.abc.net.au/4corners/digging-in:-why-powering-a-g…
The UK is banning new ICE sales in 2030, it will be interesting to see if that happens.
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I do hope you’re as interested in seeing new nuclear power technology replace oil and gas production and transport.
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Why is it funny? The reason I disparage them is as a result of looking at all the resources and process used to make them. And the more you look the less there is to like. That is not going to stop me trying to make money out of it.
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It is funny because you would make more money by encouraging the manufacturing of more EVs.
I have a suspicion that you are really an anti-EV person who goes around and are spreading stories about how bad EVs are for the environment. I have read your conservative political posts on the Conservative Fools board and on the Political Asylum board.
Jaak
I do hope you’re as interested in seeing new nuclear power technology replace oil and gas production and transport.
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Yes I am if they can develop a nuclear design that meets the following requirements
- can be located and licensed as easily as wind/solar/energy storage
- can be as safe as wind/solar/energy storage
- can be built as easily as wind/solar/energy storage
- can be built on a schedule competitive with wind/solar/energy storage
- can be cost competitive with wind/solar/energy storage
- can be maintenance, operations and fuel competitive with wind/solar/energy storage
Jaak
I do hope you’re as interested in seeing new nuclear power technology replace oil and gas production and transport.
Hate to rain on anyone’s parade but nuclear power is not coming at all. It is too costly to build.
I am not against it.
As the most expensive form of electric power it wont happen. No one has properly documented how to bring the costs way down so new nuclear power plants cab be brought into service.
Alternative energy is actually ramping up. The same guys calling for less expensive energy are offering much more expensive energy. Why?
I want deflationary forms of energy.
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Jaak said
It is funny because you would make more money by encouraging the manufacturing of more EVs.
I have a suspicion that you are really an anti-EV person who goes around and are spreading stories about how bad EVs are for the environment. I have read your conservative political posts on the Conservative Fools board and on the Political Asylum board.
Actually I have already made money and I hope to make a lot more as a result of EV’S by investing in minerals, and fast chargers and we haven’t even talked about graphite another battery component.
Why don’t you watch the doco in the link I provided, do you think I am making this up.
Why don’t you check out the news on RIO’s attempt at a lithium mine in Bosnia or the rare earths processing plant in Malaysia… But I am sure you know all this.
But I forget you are American and everything has to get political with you ppl. Pathetic.
Why don’t you check out the news on RIO’s attempt at a lithium mine in Bosnia or the rare earths processing plant in Malaysia… But I am sure you know all this.
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Australia has been a big producer of coal, copper and many other industrial minerals that have polluted the air, land and water.
I believe coal and oil to be the worst polluters in the world. Lithium, cobalt and rare earths are peanuts compared to coal pollution or oil pollution.
Renewables and EVs can change our dependence on the big polluters.
Jaak
A copper mine alone can take up to 10 years from discovery to production, no copper no electric motors and at the moment there is not enough copper mines in the world…
The UK is banning new ICE sales in 2030, it will be interesting to see if that happens.
Crusader,
There may be a day in the future when an ICE or hybrid vehicle will command a premium by virtue of either battery material shortages or electrical grid failures.
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All shortfalls for EV minerals are based on projected demand.
Projected demand has come from the mining companies and the usual suspects like UBS, Citi, Goldman Sachs etc.
You have to remember lithium is pretty common. It is the 33rd most common element on the planet. The issue with it is that lithium is widely distributed in trace amounts in rocks, soils, and oceanic and sea waters and only a fraction of identified lithium resources is in theory economically feasible for extraction.
Some forecasts
Macquarie forecast the lithium market to be in a 2,900-tonne deficit, rising to 20,200 in 2022, with the shortfall widening further to 61,000 tonnes in 2023. Credit Suisse’s deficit projections were at 117,000 tonnes and 248,000 tonnes in 2024 and 2025, respectively.
I have tons of this sort of info on lithium and other minerals from all sorts of places, however be mindful they are all based on Projected Demand
But the real question is what happens when ppl realise they are going to have to miss out on a vehicle as there are insufficient materials to make them?
Will targets be postponed? Will ppl acquiesce? If forced to convert will they revolt?
Another thing about EV’s which should be apparent to anyone who looks at the dynamics of the industry is they represent a transfer of wealth from the affluent to the less affluent by virtue of subsidies and other incentives to promote EV’s.
As an aside I know a guy who made $21m investing in LTR, and this was the only stock in his portfolio, and the guy was over 60 when he did it… So much for investment theory.
Before anyone jumps in with some political comment on all this, I am not interested and do not care what your political view is.
I look at EV’s for one purpose only and that is to make money.