Apparently five+ year old refurb desktops running under $300 occupy 8 of the top 10 spots on Amazon’s bestselling desktop list. I know the OEMs must still be doing a fair amount of business but people have clearly figured out that a) portability may not be that important b) performance has been “adequate” for most tasks for a very long time c) in an age where a PC has few moving parts there’s really little reason to go new.
Server first, then mobile… then move on. I’d hate to be the volume leading supplier of desktop CPUs.
which - in theory - provides with a free route to Windows 11 pro should they decide to do that.
That would be a negative. Computers with anything older than an Intel 8th gen processor do not qualify for moving to Win 11. I know. I have a 2017 Dell XPS with a 7th gen i5, and 11 is a no-go. Further, there are two security features that are required for Win 11. My 2017 Dell has them, but, due to the processor, 11 is not an option. I have a somewhat older HP, with an AMD A10. Not only does the processor not qualify for 11, it also lacks the security features.
Dell Inspiron 3847s with 4th gen processors are available on eBay for $50ish. Why pay ten times that for a new, Win 11 machine?
I don’t think that is it. The list at your first link lists the 7th gen Core as impacted. That is the processor my Dell has. But it also lists the 10th and 11th gen Core, which are on the approved list for Win 11.
No AMD processors are listed as having this flaw, but the A10 in my HP does not qualify for Win 11 either.
I’m certainly not chasing Win 11. 12 is due out about this time next year.
A bit more on CPU compatibility. MS cites higher reliability for 8th gen and higher CPUs. They phrase it to make the newer processors sound radically more reliable.
Devices that do not meet the minimum system requirements had 52% more kernel mode crashes. Devices that do meet the minimum system requirements had a 99.8% crash free experience.
My math says that, if an 8th gen provides 99.8% crash free experience (.2% crash), and a 7th gen has a 52% higher crash rate, than the 7th gen will provide a 99.7% crash free experience (0.2% + 52% of 0.2% crash)
Several of the articles I have read about 12 say minimum Intel processor will be an i5. One article, from India, expands that to i5, 5th gen, which my Dell meets. I’m not taking any of that to the bank tho.
I can see people’s reluctance to buy a new computer right now. MS obsoleted vast numbers of machines that were only 4 years old, whose performance far exceeded the Win 11 minimums, with the limited slate of approved CPUs. People are no doubt concerned they may be caught out again by a new requirement being imposed for 12.
Changing computers is such a hassle, so I do it as infrequently as possible. My desktop is a Win 7 box that has been updated to Win 10. Core i7 (sorry, AMD persons). I also updated the SSD and video since I bought it. It works fine, so until software demands I upgrade, I’m keeping it. I don’t like laptops, though they do have their uses (mostly travel). JMHO.
I have a Dell Insperon with a first gen i3. Came with 64bit Win 7. Also now running with Win 10. Runs well enough. Originally came with an NVidia graphics card, which the company provided a Win 10 driver for. Win 10 had drivers for the Intel chipset and Broadcom ethernet, so everything is spiffy. Over the years, I have been used to my computers being able to transition one or two OS steps. The Dell XPS, which came with 10, being unable to transition to a newer OS is a bummer.
Computers with anything older than an Intel 8th gen processor do not qualify for moving to Win 11. I know. I have a 2017 Dell XPS with a 7th gen i5, and 11 is a no-go. Further, there are two security features that are required for Win 11.
There are registry hacks to bypass these requirements.
Plenty of guides out there. Of course you’re not officially supported but…
I’m not a computer expert like the rest of you but I just bought a refurbished desktop which arrived yesterday from the HP Business Outlet. DH convinced me to buy it since the HDDs in my 2017 HP desktop are relatively old and might crash someday. They are Seagate HDDs which I transplanted from an older computer when my previous buy had a noisy Hitachi HDD.
This buying episode began when I noticed that my monitor was beginning to flicker in horizontal bands. So it started with looking for a new monitor and decided to add a new computer.
My new (refurb) computer’s description on the HP outlet’s website is: “HP ProDesk 600 G6 W11P-64 DG10-64 i3-10100 3.6GHz65W 256G NVME 16GB (1x16GB) DDR4 2666 NIC WLAN BT.” It has an Intel Core i3. It has NVME solid-state memory. It has bays and SATA connectors for 2 HDDs which I will transplant from my current computer. It has space for 2 RAM expansions. It’s running Windows 10 but is capable of Windows 11. I hope it’s capable of Windows 12 but I haven’t seen much real improvement for decades, just a lot of clutter. I’d still be using XP if Microsoft would service it. I don’t think MSFT will yank the rug out from under Windows 10 users.
The solid state computer is so quiet that I didn’t realize it turned on when I pushed the button. I actually put my cheek next to the fan to feel the slight breeze because the box doesn’t have any vibration.
I haven’t been able to use it yet because I can’t connect it to the monitor. It has three (3) DisplayPort connectors on the back plus a 10101 A connector but no HDMI or VGA connector. I ordered an HDMI to DisplayPort cable yesterday to connect this. I don’t do gaming so I can’t imagine what I would use 3 DisplayPort connectors for. It also has 2 Super Speed USB ports in addition to regular USB ports.
I wanted to look at the inside so I took the cover off. It has 2 nice bays for the HDDs. But I had trouble putting the cover back on so I asked DH to do it. He slightly bent the cover in the process of putting it back on.
DH has a laptop but I do all my work at my desk. Call me crazy but I like doing financial transactions over an ethernet cable instead of by WiFi or even phone. I don’t do the kind of work that requires a computer (spreadsheets, long documents) when I travel.
HP was running a sale – discounting $25 off a refurb monitor. So I got the computer plus a 22" HD monitor for $602, including tax. I expect this to last several years at least.
Are you sure it is running 10? That spec says 64bit, Win 11 Pro.
As for the i3 processor, welcome to my world. What I have seen about 12 so far says i5 or higher processor, ie an i3 doesn’t qualify. We will know for sure in a year, when 12 is released.
How could they sell you a monitor that doesn’t have the right interface to connect to the computer they sold you?
The HP site is pretty skimpy on specs. If the new machine has a PCIe X16 card slot, and your old machine has a moveable graphics card, I would move the card to the new machine.
Sure, MS will leave Win 10 users high and dry. They already ended support for 8, and everything before it. The encouraging thing is browser and a/v publishers still support OSes going back to 7, so, even though MS will abandon 10, I expect to still be able to use the machine with some degree of security.
Last thing: mechanical hard drives are stupid cheap. I picked up a 1TB Western Digital at Office Depot a couple weeks ago, on sale, at $38. I had some reward bux to apply to it, and a coupon that paid me more reward bux for making the purchase, and I did their on-line survey, for more reward bux, so my net cost was something like $24. If the data you are backing up on the SATA drive will be important, I would leave your ancient Seagates where they are and buy a new HD.
@g0177325 yes, the computer I got is the microtower on the right. My older brother, @OrmontUS, was in the computer business for 25+ years. He recommended that I always shop for a new computer on the HP Business Outlet.
I have always been satisfied with the products and prices there. But it’s a constantly-changing list, depending on what people happen to return.
These were both refurbished items from a list that randomly adds as people and/ or companies return HP products. A refurbished model may have been returned because a customer changed their mind, a newer model took its place, a cancelled order, cosmetic blemish, or simply because the packaging was marred.
The computer’s 3 DisplayPort connectors tells me that somebody intended to connect 3 high-speed displays, perhaps a stockbroker company. But that’s just a guess. The monitor I bought was a generic cheapie, certainly not intended to be used with this computer. I never heard of “DisplayPort” until yesterday when the hardware arrived. It never occurred to me that there wouldn’t be compatible connectors.
The spec is a new computer. Mine is an old, refurbished computer. The sales rep told me over the phone that he checked that specific item. It is running Win 10 but has everything needed to install Win 11.
I don’t know anything about graphics cards. How would I find out whether the new computer has a graphics card? If it does it would probably be better than the old one. But How would I know?
Type “sysinfo” in the Search field to find and then run the System Information app, and expand the Display tree. My laptop shows two graphics devices: the first is the discrete NVIDIA card and the second is the integrated graphics of my AMD CPU:
Thanks for the clarification. Yes, a 10th gen i3 will run 11. It almost certainly has Secure Boot and TMP, the security features required by 11. There is an app on the Microsoft web site that you can download that will confirm your computer is ready for 11. But then, as soon as you connect to Windows Update, it will want to install 11, which will confirm your computer qualifies.
Make sure your printer is supported on 11. I checked with the Canon site, on my ancient printer. Their site said they tested it, and it will work on the initial release of 11, but they have no intention of supporting it on 11.
I need to run to the post office. Another old piece of software sold on eBay this morning. (yay). I’ll get in to the graphics question when I get home.