OT:Escalation of Middle East Conflict Risk

There would have been another excuse.

I remember reading a translated Saudi newspaper in college. We were labeled the devil throughout the reporting.

You are assuming Jews are the problem. It has nothing to do with Israel or the Palestinians. It is pure power politics. The local young guys in Yemen would not sign up to fight other Muslims in Yemen. The Houthis are using Palestine to get recruits to fight in Israel. The recruits though are sent to fight against other Yemenis.

The Houthi rockets are only to back up their claim they are fighting Israel. Their goals have nothing to do with Israel. Firing on US ships also scores them hate points with young idiots.

1 Like

History repeats. Even pre-history repeats.

The Captain

1 Like

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/scoop-israeli-defense-chief-tells-us-he-wont-allow-rebuilding-of-settlements-in-gaza/ar-BB1hqID1
Israeli Minister of Defense Yoav Gallant told U.S. officials last week that he and the Israeli military will not allow the rebuilding of illegal outposts or settlements by Israeli settlers inside the Gaza Strip, four U.S. and Israeli officials told Axios.

The White House’s position that these are all unrelated conflicts that are just cropping up at the same time can’t be squared with the evidence showing that the war in Gaza has fueled regional instability and violence, including the recent drone attack by an Iraqi militia that killed three American service members and injured more than 40 at a base in Jordan earlier this week.

As much as the administration might want to keep the conflict confined to Gaza, the truth is that it has spread to several other countries. It is a disservice to the American people and to American military personnel to pretend that U.S. support for the war in Gaza hasn’t already had serious negative consequences for regional stability and for American forces in the region when it clearly has.

When he was asked about this “same, larger conflict” at a press conference on Wednesday, National Security Council spokesman John Kirby dismissed any link between Gaza and the U.S. fight with the Houthis or the back-and-forth strikes between local militias and U.S. forces.

I absolutely don’t agree with your description of the same, larger conflict.

Kirby’s answer is misleading and false. The umbrella group in Iraq that claimed responsibility for the attack in Jordan, the Islamic Resistance of Iraq, explicitly stated that its attack was connected to the war in Gaza. The Houthi leadership has been emphatic that their attacks will continue for as long as the war does. The decision of other actors to jump on a cause’s bandwagon may be cynical or not, but there is no denying that they have jumped on the bandwagon.

Refusing to face the reality of the connections between these conflicts guarantees that the U.S. will pursue ineffective and counterproductive policies by ignoring that the key to defusing regional tensions is to bring the war in Gaza to an end as quickly as possible.

No surprise here. Just like the US War on Terror in which trillions of dollars were wasted, more hatred in the region created by drone killing of innocents, to say nothing of US military deaths and permanently maimed personnel.
WMDs in Iraq, victory around the corner in Afghanistan, attacks on shipping & US military personnel unrelated to Gaza genocide; all lies to continue US despicable foreign policy interventionist agenda.

The most ferocious attacks have come from the air, flattening entire city blocks and cratering the landscape.

The Washington Post analyzed satellite imagery, airstrike data and U.N. damage assessments, and interviewed more than 20 aid workers, health-care providers, and experts in munitions and aerial warfare. The evidence shows that Israel has carried out its war in Gaza at a pace and level of devastation that likely exceeds any recent conflict, destroying more buildings, in far less time, than were destroyed during the Syrian regime’s battle for Aleppo from 2013 to 2016 and the U.S.-led campaign to defeat the Islamic State in Mosul, Iraq, and Raqqa, Syria, in 2017.

The war has wounded more than 53,320 people, according to the Gaza Health Ministry. More than 7,700 Palestinian children have been killed, and women and children make up around 70 percent of the dead, according to the U.N. Office for the Coordination of Humanitarian Affairs

Yet they do not surrender. Perhaps their perceived 75 years of ill treatment by Israel weight heavier in their minds. The current deaths of women
and children just adds more onto the scale.

Viewed from another angle after the October 7th attack by Hamas.

An Israeli lawmaker from the ruling right-wing Likud Party on Wednesday offered fresh evidence that the Israeli government’s aim in its bombardment of Gaza is a genocidal effort to kill or forcibly remove the more than 2 million Palestinians living there, declaring, “Gaza should be erased.”

I understand the rage. There was similar rage within the USA after the 9/11 attack. It led to the US war on Terror campaign which was a failure.

And what was the #1 reason bin Laden gives for the attack? Palestine.

Why are we fighting and opposing you? The answer is very simple:

(1) Because you attacked us and continue to attack us.

a) You attacked us in Palestine:

(i) Palestine, which has sunk under military occupation for more than 80 years. The British handed over Palestine, with your help and your support, to the Jews, who have occupied it for more than 50 years; years overflowing with oppression, tyranny, crimes, killing, expulsion, destruction and devastation. The creation and continuation of Israel is one of the greatest crimes, and you are the leaders of its criminals. And of course there is no need to explain and prove the degree of American support for Israel. The creation of Israel is a crime which must be

erased. Each and every person whose hands have become polluted in the contribution towards this crime must pay itsprice, and pay for it heavily.*

1 Like

Stop and think for a moment about the fact that you are more willing to take the word of an admitted terrorist over the word of John Kirby. Examine your bias.

And as far as this stuff just starting after 10/7, Tower 22 in Jordan has been attacked 3 times in the last 6 months. 10/7 was less than 4 months ago.

Even before Tower 22 became part of the news, our military was under attack.

Here is one from January of last year near Tower 22:

Another just a few days later:

Just because you and the author of that article are not aware doesn’t mean that this has not been going on prior to Oct 7.

5 Likes

As the USian media continues to natter about USian reprisals against the boogymen, the narrative is a days/weeks long bombing campaign in Syria and Iraq. I get the location reasoning: Iraqi and Syrian militaries have been sharply attritted by years of war. Iran can defend itself. Would not look good in the papers for shot down USian pilots to be marched off to prison in Iran.

But, what will the Syrian and Iraqi governments think of the US bombing the daylights out of their sovereign territory?

I don’t think people are thinking this through.

Steve

1 Like

I take it you are just as unaware that we are already there “bombing” their territory, with their permission?

Here is the 2022 Year end summary:

Snip (note the “partnered” operations):

During calendar year 2022, CENTCOM conducted 313 total operations against ISIS in Iraq and Syria as follows:

 In Syria:
 108 partnered operations
 14 US unilateral operations
 215 ISIS operatives detained
 466 ISIS operatives killed

 In Iraq:
 191 partnered operations
 159 ISIS operatives detained
 At least 220 ISIS operatives killed

4 Likes

The regimes would be fine with the US watching their backs.

What would the government reaction be to an attack on an entity the government does not regard as an enemy, like the US assassination of Qasem Soleimani?

Outgoing Prime Minister Adel Abdul Mahdi condemned the attack, calling it an assassination and stating that the strike was an act of aggression and a breach of Iraqi sovereignty which would lead to war in Iraq and declared three days of national mourning. He said the strike violated the agreement on the presence of U.S. forces in Iraq and that safeguards for Iraq’s security and sovereignty should be met with legislation. The media office of the Iraqi military’s joint operations forces posted a photo of a destroyed vehicle on fire after the attack. The speaker of Iraq’s parliament Mohammed al Halbousi vowed to “put an end to U.S. presence” in Iraq. On January 5 in reaction to the airstrikes the Iraqi parliament passed a bill calling for the expulsion of US troops from the country

You keep posting various links to things, but none of those things bolster your statement. I’ll remind you that your claim was this -

Israel has a policy to take Palestinian land on the cheap by expanding settlements into Gaza.

So name a settlement in Gaza and tell us how many Israelis live in it. Tell us which settlement in Gaza has been expanded. Come on, you can do it.

Daniel Larison is a terrorist? Who knew?

Check your bias.

Hawkin:“Just because you and the author of that article are not aware doesn’t mean that this has not been going on prior to Oct 7.”

US presence in Syria is illegal in violation of international law. No UN mandate. No US declaration of war nor congressional approval of the Syrian intervention. Syria certainly did not invite us. We are there because of the US War on Terror by regime change agenda that spawned Iraq, Libya, Syria interventions.
Keeping US troops in nations that do not want us makes them a target. We went to Syria hoping to remove Assad. That objective failed. He is unable to remove us physically by military means. Just what purpose do those achieve besides sticking a thumb in Assad’s eye?

1 Like

Do you honestly think I was claiming that Daniel Larison was claiming responsibility for the attack or the entity that actually made the claim, the Islamic Resistance of Iraq?

Are you again being disingenuous or is this a case of your being very obtuse?

Ayup. I think I mentioned recently, how the USian media was beating the drums for intervention in Syria. CBS “news” in particular, was touting “rare access”, though they seemed to be running these “reports” almost daily, of visiting Syrians in refugee camps, with the interpreter voice over claiming the women and children on camera were saying “where is America? America has to help us”, as if people who take up arms against their government are shocked and surprised, when the government hits back.

Hawkwin posted the body counts of US ops against ISIS in Syria and Iraq. The attacks today were not against ISIS. They were against Iranian Revolutionary Guards, ie Iranian government military, in those countries. If the US can take umbrage against attacks against it’s forces in those countries, what would the reasonable person expect Iran’s reaction to it’s troops being attacked be?

Meanwhile, the neocon “thought leaders” are baying for Iranian blood.

I don’t see a deescalation coming out of this, anytime soon.

Steve

1 Like

Syria is in the Russian orbit. The Russians did not have the forward offensive power to go after ISIS so we are there.

Yet we face Iran and other Russian proxies across the Middle East.

We could back down just because we have a few tears about ourselves. No not the Palestinians, Israelis, and other Arabs, just about ourselves. Misplaced as that is.

Middle Eastern populations are not European. This will all die down.

It won’t go away because the governance lacks mechanisms to allow freedom of religion. That lack may go on for hundreds of years more.

1 Like

Seems to me the US intervention in Syria was not about Russia, but about trying to unhorse Assad, as the Assads, father and son, had been an irritant to Israel for a long time. Remember the “Arab spring”, when repressive regimes in the ME saw uprisings? The US wanted to leverage that “freedom” narrative to promote the civil war in Syria. Russia intervened on Assad’s side. Took some very careful coordination so that US planes bombing Assad’s forced did not run afoul of Russian planes bombing the rebels.

Steve

2 Likes

We kept separate from the Russians and Assad going only after ISIS. We tripped over that border just to chase down ISIS. We kept to that.

1 Like

We kept separate from the Russians and Assad going only after ISIS. We tripped over that border just to chase down ISIS. We kept to that.

Negatory. First, there was “Timber Sycamore”, a CIA op to arm and train Syrian rebels to fight against the Assad regime, and USian sanctions against the Syrian government, in 2011. The US started directly attacking Syrian government facilities in 2017. In 2016, the US claimed it was attacking ISIS, but they were actually attacking Syrian government forces. Intervention in Syria was always about trying to tip over Assad.

3 Likes

That was earlier. I did not say we were innocent or naive.