Refugee immigrantion, and what is a "safe" country?

For those who have not been following migration issues in the UK, the PM is still pushing his scheme to deport migrants to Rwanda. If Rwanda is “safe”, I guess the genocide that happened there a while back, didn’t really happen, and is only a product of a deranged imagination.

We have discussed here, whether Mexico is a “safe” country, within the meaning of international treaties on treatment of refugees. If Mexico is the first “safe” country refugees from other countries enter, Mexico would be obligated to accommodate them, rather than passing them along to the US.

The Telegraph, and Reuters, are both floating a narrative that a plan is afloat in the US to adopt a mass deportation scheme, to a “safe” country.

Some South American countries are relatively immigrant friendly, but would they demur if a “thought leader’s” plan to give 11M people the bum’s rush became reality?


And the climate refugees haven’t really hit the US yet. The US is dealing with economic, political, and slavery - sexual as well as labor poorly. I am sure that ChatGPT will solve this. Or maybe our mega-billionaire overlords will find a way to make money shipping them off-world.



Mexico is not required to accommodate them.

They (the migrants) would be required to apply for asylum in the first safe country. If that is Mexico, then Mexico would then use their own rules and policies to decide how to adjudicate those applicants - and in many cases just like in the US, may refuse entry.


You know why we wound up in Venezuela? Mexico would not admit widows. The family had made plans to go to Mexico and had all the paperwork done but two of the women, my mom being one them, became widows before they could emigrate. The family contacted cousins in Venezuela who arranged for travel to Venezuela.

The Captain


iirc, that “adjudicate” phase is what has some people so hopped up, phrasing it as “catch and release”. Lacking huge concentration camps to hold the applicants, they are released into the US until their hearing date arrives. The news reports that many people don’t sneak across the border, but surrender to the Border Patrol as soon as they cross, knowing they will be quickly released. So, we had a “stay in Mexico” policy for a while. Now there is chatter about flying them to Chile, or Ecuador, or wherever is willing to temporarily house them.

Can’t help but wonder if the “catch and release” policy is entirely the “touchy-feelies” at work, or is that astroturf laid by the “JCs” that want cheap, easily exploited, labor?


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Ya know, not EVERYTHING is a grand conspiracy of JCs, right? I know it is a challenge but can you post about a topic without it somehow incorporating your personal boogyman?

“Stay in Mexico” is not the same as “Safe Third Country.” If someone came to America from Mexico and cannot prove that they were first adjudicated in Mexico, then they are summarily deported (there are a few exceptions).

Note, this is the same rule in place for Canada and USA. If someone enters Canada to claim asylum without first having applied in the USA, they are deported (again unless they meet one of the exceptions).

Personally, it seems rational that we have the same policy with Mexico. Excessive mass migration is neither good for the country losing population nor the country gaining such. The potential for migrants to eventually return to their country of origin is higher if they remain closer to home.


From the link you provided:

To date, the US is the only country that is designated as a safe third country by Canada under the Immigration and Refugee Protection Act.

That is the question posed in the OP. The piece at that link does not say whether that evaluation is limited to countries in North America, or the Western Hemisphere. Seems Canada would regard most countries in western Europe, for example, as “safe”. Criteria Canada uses include “rule of law” and not torturing people. Given that a POTUS, not that many years ago, bragged about grabbing people off the street, tossing them in prison with no legal due process, and torturing them, I’m not sure Canada’s designation of the US as “safe” is all that valid. Would any country in South America qualify as “safe”, given their histories of coups and repression, for the purposes of the program being floated at the link in the OP?

I gave you a choice, “T-F” or “JC” :slight_smile:



Go ask the CEO’s of Tyson Foods. Of home builders. Go ask people running landscaping companies, plumbers, house cleaning. Heck, go ask the rural north Texas dairy farmers that I know, who constantly complain about the border, why knowingly and willingly employ these people.

You thought we had inflation and labor shortages when coming out of the pandemic? Just wait until you truly “secure” the border and kick those people out.


Indeed. I remember a couple bits of “enforcement theater” at a couple Swift packing plants, rounding up illegals. some years ago. I did a bit of reading on packing plant labor. Seems that, when the packing plants moved out of union areas, like Chicago, to the plains, and started hiring illegals, wage rates paid fell abut 40%. iirc it was Tom Tancredo (now a private citizen, so assume he is fair game) that was howling about the pushback he was receiving for his anti-immigrant stance. “If we can’t use immigrant labor, your lettuce will cost more”, he quoted the “JCs”.

In nice weather, I walk around the neighborhood for exercise. In my walks, I often pass the groundskeeping crew at the apartments next door on break…Spanish only spoken. The guy who the condo association sends to seal water leaks in my basement has a Mexican flag tat on his arm, and personal calls he takes on his cell while he is working are always in Spanish. The local Lowe’s has all it’s signage in both English and Spanish.

The obvious solution would be to ease restrictions on immigration, so more people could come here legally. But no. The push is to sharply reduce legal as well as illegal immigration.



Many will find this hard to believe, and I cannot find many articles with numbers that I find credible

but from what I can see Mexicans are net moving back to Mexico from USA. The in migration to USA is now overwhelmingly from Central and South America.

Mexico’s industrial base is growing rapidly, and the USA will increasingly need another source of cheap labor.

d fb


My comments. The business people in the US and Mexico want the Central and South Americans in Mexico to work. Mexico needs the labor. Those American companies with factories in Mexico need the labor. As pay goes up in Mexico gang activity will drop.

The unemployment rate averaged 4.0% in the decade to 2022, below the 8.2% average for Latin America. The unemployment rate in Mexico in 2022 was 3.3% .

Mexico Unemployment Forecast & Data - FocusEconomics.


Fat chance. Mexico like the USA is profoundly lacking in civic virtue while drowning in private and tribal greed.

d fb
(I am rejoicing in the bravery of the men of Texcaltitlan
At least 11 dead after clash between gang and villagers in central Mexico | Crime News | Al Jazeera)


I’ve told this story before. About 10 years ago or so, a house we used to own. Built in 1962, before PVC was used, so it had cast-iron sewer pipes. Those do not last forever. Replacing them meant tunneling under the slab. Those pipes were leaking VERY BAD. Guess what was in all that mud that the workers were hand-shoveling through? Everyone spoke Spanish on that job. The owner of the plumbing company told me “I cannot pay a white guy enough to do this job”. He was not joking, he was dead serious.

We don’t need fewer immigrants. We need them. Possibly we need more of them. Building a wall is the worst thing we could do. What we need to have is reform that will let more of them in.

But I will re-iterate: kick them all out, or make all of them legal, and you will see wage inflation like nothing we have seen before. Be careful what you wish for.


Build a wall around the self-proclaimed “JCs”, then seal it. Profits will be quite easy to tax. They unloaded the costs of all those fake JCs…

As discussed here previously, that may be the push behind relaxing child labor laws, so children can be used, in place of migrants. Then there is “Plan Steve”, to force able bodied retirees back into the workforce, tho geezers, even relatively fit ones, lack the strength, agility, and endurance, of teenagers.


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