I quit! Title must be at least 15 characters. You got it. Want more?

Sorry, I can’t make heads or tails of this pile of crap.

Bye.

The Captain

Maybe they’ll bring back the old Fool. Email me if they do.

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His cantankerous, never-wrong, S-curve-obsessed posts will be missed.

I hope he finds peace yelling at a cloud somewhere.

Dreamer

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More likely you’ll get an emailed obituary.

A few months back…well before TMF announced it was dumping the boards that it presumably felt were its gift to a bunch of freeloaders…I mentioned on the Running Fools board how sparce and threadbare the boards looked these days. One poster observed that, back in HIS early days on the site, the handful of boards on his Favorites list would oftentimes keep him busy for half a morning most days a week…as opposed to nowadays (his time of posting) it could take him almost as long searching searching for one or two meaningful posts. I doubt the new format will remedy that.

Unless the subscription boards are performing dramatically differently from these free…or as I think of them foundational boards (they did provide for TMF to build its business back in the day)…I can’t imagine how it can stumble along beyond the near future.

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One “improved” feature… should you, perchance, wish to use a perfectly acceptable word in common usage to describe the type of gait used when attempting to walk with one injured leg (take a guess…a 4 letter word beginning with L, ending with P with an I and an M in between) the TMF nanny filter will let you know immediately that it’s “not allowed”.

“Stumble” is probably better, come to think of it.

Captains usually go down with the ship…being a wise butz…

Seriously…we are older folks usually complaining about younger people not working. LOL This is titled with “15 characters…”? LOL

C’mon I am not a pimple on the computer talent with tons of history here. This is easy.

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“Easy” depends on a lot of things - your vision (can deteriorate in old age), consistency of interface (previously, you had ‘view a post’ UX view and ‘view board’ UX view and that was mostly it - now, we have a dozen different types of page, which you get bounced between, all visually different in structure, buzzing with notifications, badges, timestamps, avatars, …).

I have a lot of sympathy for anyone who says ‘sod this’. This software’s UX is full of gimmicks and visual inconsistency, and it’s hard to believe those who designed it were thinking of older users, people who might have impaired vision or concentration, or people who struggle to navigate more complex user interfaces.

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In all fairness, I no longer code, I have a lot of experience learning new systems. I push through. The perception of an artist might be with a paint brush in hand. As a digital artist who has mastered Photoshop and worse Blender and now am training in financial software…but we have had long discussions on computer coding and some people here have reigned supreme over every detail.

The age is not the issue for most posters here. It is a lack of experience. Or a refusal to be experienced. This groups also discusses younger people being lazy.

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@leap1

The age is not the issue for most posters here. It is a lack of experience. Or a refusal to be experienced.


It’s literally not that, in any way - it’s about visual clutter and (unnecessary) complexity in the interface, combined with unpredictable failures (rate limiting, print limiting).

I suggest reading the posts other people have written more carefully and maybe trying the ‘screen reader’ empathy building idea I posted on the other thread.

I assure you that there are computer systems I use, visual & otherwise, far more complex than this. I’ve been a programmer for over 35 years; a systems admin for complex systems since the 90s. Nonetheless, I don’t enjoy this system. It’s work; continual work, just to navigate it and do things I want to do.


This new system certainly makes some things easier than the old system - for example: seeing who exactly liked your post - exactly which minute of the day they liked it - what kind of ‘like’ feeling they had for it - the visual appearance of the person who liked it - but unfortunately, those are all things I don’t actually want to do. Not only that:

  • Seeing people’s visual appearance just adds in fresh opportunity for ageism, sexism, and racism, where none existed before.

  • Seeing ‘who liked and who didn’t’ is going to lead to ‘like cliques’ and tribalism between view points.

  • Seeing when people liked, may have people wondering ‘why isn’t X reading my posts!’.


The issue that some people are unhappy with, is the unnecessary aspects of complexity, the decrease in intuitiveness, the lack of instant practicality of an interface in relation to the thing you are trying to do with it.

The multiplicity and variety of interfaces here, even when mastered, represent a net loss if compared to a smaller set of simple interfaces that achieve the same outcome.

Yes, I can do in Photoshop the same task that Meme Generator - Imgflip does, but the latter lets me do it in 10 seconds. So most people enjoy to use something like memegenerator - because life is short.

And also, please try to have more empathy for all types of user - i.e. including those with poor vision, shaky hands, maybe a little more tired and less able to concentrate at length on a complex interface, or low confidence about more complex computer systems. We are not all blessed with perfect bodies and minds.

There are people in this world, for whom a panel of flashing buttons would be a nightmare, and others for whom it is a novelty and curiosity.

There are people in this world, for whom a single flickering light or humming piece of equipment in a nearby room, makes it impossible to do work. Not because of a lack of willpower or concentration, but because their brain simply is wired that way.

Having a paralysed ability to maintain concentration on a complex task, is not all that different to having a paralysed leg. You want to use it; but you can’t.

Referring back to your comment - would you say people with paralysed legs are just ‘refusing to walk’?


Yelling “Haha! I can swim! Look! Swimming is easy! What’s the big problem!” over and over on multiple threads - while others feel they’re slipping under the waves, or give up and resign themselves to sleeping at the bottom of the ocean - really isn’t as great a look as you think it is.


And some people just prefer sitting on a boat, or the beach, to the feeling like they’re constantly swimming.

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This is easy to navigate.

The only thing going on is it is new. There is no excessive clutter. There is a header, a left hand column and a body of messages. This is not complex.

I have sympathy for sick people. I have sympathy for purposely under paid people. I have sympathy for people facing racism, misogyny, homophobia, and a host of other discrimination.

I can not have sympathy or empathy just because some folks find something new.

I do not have sympathy for people losing money in this market. This life is not about them coasting into retirement. The local golfers are having a bad season. The reason often is their stock market returns mean they should be working instead of playing.

I feel finally after four decades the country is having sympathy and empathy for people paid less than $15 per hour. But that last 40 years was about using people with no empathy. We have discussions here where not using people is seen as harmful to the economy.

I am not sure who needs the empathy on this board.

Simply take it slow. Organize it in your minds. This is a very simple organized page.

I have empathy for the moderators and technicians who have to read the constant complaints.

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There is clutter. Posts from people I don’t want to read are right in my face!

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Be respectful to people.

There is no clutter at all.

There is a header, there is a left hand column and there is the body of posts.

It’s only been a few days and yet the crying began on day one. How do these people make it through life without learning something new at least once a day?

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You have made your point repeatedly, and have fully established your feelings. I accept you do not see clutter, I accept you do not feel empathy for anyone who does find this unpleasant to navigate.

It’s now totally clear how you feel, you’ve said it multiple times. There is no doubt.


Now, can I ask you to stop posting it please?

If other people are saying ‘hey, I have a problem with this’, then yelling over and over multiple times ‘no you aren’t!’ is going to lead to big unpleasant arguments as well as clogged threads.


It isn’t a great look to be the guy who keeps re-joining the queue at The Complaints Desk of the supermarket, over and over, so they can loudly shout:

‘I’M NOT HAVING ANY PROBLEMS HERE! NONE OF YOU ARE!’

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@buynholdisdead

the crying

Be honest - do you really think that’s a mature, sympathetic or helpful response here?

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It is a bit confusing. I know plenty of people that (generally) are tech challenged and changing anything about a UI causes them pain. (Telling them they are dumb doesn’t help.)
If you just create categories for your favorite boards and tags for your favorite companies things start to work well

Mike

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Lux you have been complaining all over the place do you think that is mature or helpful? It’s a new system, don’t you think the complaining should start after you have given it a try for two weeks? I learned how to categorize today and Now I am stoked, yes learning something new is frustrating but at least give it some time.

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Things that helped with the clutter: I usually use a 27" iMac so things are big.

Dark mode.
Making text smaller.
Realized the little icons are the people posting, so scan those, so I can prepare myself… Smaller font makes it seem less like people are shouting at me.

There are a lot more variables one has to understand before making this an experience that isn’t overwhelmed by the interface, itself. It’s still evolving. But dark mode and smaller text has helped – a lot.

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You are totally correct. There is a longer history of complaining about the fool that has been very unfair to the fool.

Lux,

You can ask. LOL

Seriously sinking in the mud is not how you help people.

@buynholdisdead

First - I noticed you deflected from my criticism of your attitude, by attacking me.

Perhaps you can answer my question first, before you ask your own?

It’s a discussion board. This is a thread someone has set up to discuss concerns about the tech platform.

If you know of a way to raise concerns that could potentially be fixed or addressed - but without ever mentioning them to anyone - ie. perhaps keeping them inside your head silently - well, let me know when you IPO with that, and I’ll buy stock in it.


Anyway, this feels rather like having a ‘how dare you stand here!’ scene at the Customer Support Desk of the supermarket, where a customer is standing alongside the desk, berating the other customers for daring to raise their concerns.

No idea why anyone would do that, but, I guess I’m from another culture.


If you don’t like participating in the topic of the thread, or you don’t like seeing what other people are saying on this thread - then rather than accusing people of ‘crying’ or singling them out for persecution for the crime of failing to enjoy what you enjoy, just use the little ‘Bell’ icon on the right hand side of the thread, you can click that and mute this entire thread.


Insisting everyone else has to shut up and stop ‘crying’ because you are unwilling to click that Bell, is not very fair to everyone else, is it?

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